NC750X intermittant problems

[Guest cokey]

Hi all. I've been following the forum for a while but this is my first post.

 

I have owned a NC750X from new since June 2015 with the bike having now covered 4100 miles. It had a second service a few weeks ago.

 

After about 6 to 8 months of ownership, I noticed that the engine became sounded more noisy, particularly at the front, and the bike would judder when accelerating from low speed (as if in the wrong gear). I took it back to the supplying dealer who adjusted the clutch lever but stated they couldn't find anything else wrong with it. Whilst they had my bike, I was loaned an identical 750X. The difference was chalk and cheese. The loan bike had similar mileage but the engine was a lot quieter with noticeably smoother acceleration.

 

I put up with the bike but a few weeks ago, decided to take it to another dealer for a fresh pair of eyes to look at it. The technician took it out for a ride and listened to the engine, even recording the sound and sending this to Honda. The verdict was that it 'could' be the cam chain and I would need to book the bike in. My bike was duly booked in and after a few days, I was told that there could be something be wrong with it but 'those higher up the food chain have said we're not going to look any further because Honda won't pay us if there is nothing found'. The technician told me that a possible cause of the noise I was hearing was the irregular shape of the front disc passing through the pads.  I was a bit disappointed to say the least.

 

I continue to ride the bike on a daily 28 mile round trip to work which involves mainly A roads.

 

The symptoms I am getting include:

 

Engine rattling - sounds like it coming from the front

Burning oil smell

Foaming oil visible when looking through oil filler hole

Engine extremely hot - too hot to touch

Notchy gear change - particularly when changing down

Freeplay on clutch lever increases even though adjuster locked

 

The above happens around 60% of the time.

 

I have been in touch with Honda Customer Service who have logged the problems and will get back to me in a couple of days after they have spoken to the dealers concerned.

 

Has anyone had a similar experience with there bike?

 

 

[DaveM59 1,603]

Excess heat can effect many things even the gear change and clutch action especially when lubed with the same burned oil that is going round the engine. My guess is the thermostat has stuck closed or the coolant is not circulating for other reasons such as a damaged water pump. Could also be a blown head gasket caused by overheating.

This may have been a single instance causing collateral damage and is possibly a good example of why a water temperature gauge is essential on all engines.

Checkout the coolant levels and not just in the expansion bottle but at the main filler cap.

Alternatively a serious fault has occurred in the clutch basket assembly such as a disintegrating clutch disc or pressure plate or the oil pressure is low or the circulation restricted and therefore not helping with the cooling as it should.

 

Whatever it is the dealer that is frightened of a refused warranty payment needs naming and shaming as it should be patently obvious there is a fault and therefore will be paid out. If the problem was intermittent, hardly noticeable and down to a finickity owner splitting hairs over something trivial then it's understandable. Keep trying other dealers or threaten to trade it in and put them on the spot. If they won't take it then they know there is a serious problem, if they will trade in they know they will still have to fix it to sell it again so forcing them to fix it either way. Easier just to fix it for you and see the back of you.

[Tex 36,816]

Welcome to the forum, Martin. I'm sorry to hear of your troubles and (although long distance diagnosis is fraught with difficulties) it does sound as though your dealer could really try a bit harder on your behalf. And Honda should man up and 'own' the problem too. Good luck, keep us informed, please.

[bazza 3,629]

wish I could give you an tech answer but as suggested offer to give the dealer a "nice" write up and feedback on social media

the other thing is a solicitor - funny how fast a seller reacts when the law is brought in.

 

I would write them a recorded delivery letter stating that "unless they acted within 10 days of receipt that you are

(a) rejecting the bike as not of merchantable quality

( Want as full refund

or you will go to law

I am sure you would win!

 

baz

[Guest bonekicker]

Martin your bike sounds--rather poorly-- and Yes the dealer should--get your bike sorted out for you--and stop messing about--name and shame him--on this forum and facebook--or plenty of fish !!!!    

[Tonyj 6,907]

Don't sound good to me . Trouble is that they turn away and what can you do . Sometimes these people are no better then poorly trained apologies . Well take it back to the original dealer and buy the bike he loaned you . See if he crinkles his nose up , See why he don't want it and get a friend to film you on his phone , then inform him you will tweet/ Facebook blah blah to everyone who might listen including honda HQ . Might get a different response ,don't think you'll be burning any good bridges here so what does it matter

[Guest sykospain]

Good ideas Tony !

In my previous acquaintance with the various marbled halls of BMW bike dealers, most of them are simply accountants dressed in overalls.

Waviing at them a stick made of "The Law" has an instant effect on their recalcitrance, in my experience.  Maybe it would have the same effect on a less-than-cooperative Honda dealer...

[embee 7,288]

Hi  Martin and welcome. Sorry to hear you're having issues with the bike.

 

I do all my own work on my bikes. If it were mine I'd start at the very basics. First do a valve clearance check, if these are out for any reason it won't run ideally whatever else may or may not be wrong. Only turn the engine forwards (same direction as wheels turn) just to be on the safe side so it doesn't load the camchain tensioner unnecessarily.

I think the tensioner can be removed for inspection relatively easily though I haven't done it personally, I've  only read the section in the workshop manual. There have been a few cases of tensioners needing replacement but they are few.

 

Check the plugs carefully, they should be fine for 30+k miles but it's not impossible for there to be a problem so a good look is simple. Make sure the plug caps pop fully home on the plugs, it's easy to not get them quite fully home (DAMHIK). Any irregular firing faults can cause irregular running and can make it sound "tockety". Once running again, check carefully for any signs of arcing around the HT leads and caps. one or two instances of this have been reported. Really needs to be in a dark environment (garage etc) but obviously take usual precautions about running engines in closed spaces. You can try using a hand spray bottle of water to see if you get any arcing, the HT leads should be tolerant of water spray.

 

Next, do an ECU "reset", the process is simple (and free). It cannot do any harm even if it doesn't actually achieve anything. Basically disconnect battery for a few minutes, 30mins if you want to be absolutely sure (not critical how long). From cold, start the engine WITHOUT TOUCHING THE THROTTLE. Do not touch it, and allow it to run at idle UNTIL FAN KICKS IN, this takes around 15mins. Stop it using the KILL SWITCH, wait for a short time (maybe 30sec) and then turn the ignition off. Reset the kill switch and you're good to go.

 

Check the battery connections are clean and tightened properly. I'd also check the common earth point at the front left side of the riders seat behind the panels. There are a lot of wires here. Undo the bolt, clean the eyelets, refit and tighten properly.

 

Make sure the oil level is not too high. Bike upright, hot engine and stopped for a couple of minutes, dipstick resting on threads NOT screwed in, oil should NOT be above the max mark. Personally I've always found Castrol Power1 10W30 works nicely, but choose your own poison.

 

I'd also look carefully at the drive chain and sprockets. The original chains can be rather "coarse" in operation. Fitting a new DID VX2 chain to mine made it much smoother feel to ride.

 

I'm not suggesting any or all of these are what your issues may be, but that's the stuff I'd be checking. Remote diagnosis can't be more precise I'm afraid.

 

Mechanically the NC range is proving pretty reliable, so fears of serious issues should be put into perspective.

Edited June 28, 2016 by embee

[Guest cokey]

Thanks for all the replies.

 

The latest update is that the supplying dealer have had the bike since Wednesday and following a phone call this morning, I'm told they can't find anything wrong with it.

 

The salesman that sold the bike to me has offered to run it for a couple of days to see if the faults show.

 

We'll see what happens next week.

[Tex 36,816]

Well, at least things are moving. Thanks for the update. Let us know how you get on.

[bazza 3,629]

Hi  Martin and welcome. Sorry to hear you're having issues with the bike.

 

I do all my own work on my bikes. If it were mine I'd start at the very basics. First do a valve clearance check, if these are out for any reason it won't run ideally whatever else may or may not be wrong. Only turn the engine forwards (same direction as wheels turn) just to be on the safe side so it doesn't load the camchain tensioner unnecessarily.

I think the tensioner can be removed for inspection relatively easily though I haven't done it personally, I've  only read the section in the workshop manual. There have been a few cases of tensioners needing replacement but they are few.

 

Check the plugs carefully, they should be fine for 30+k miles but it's not impossible for there to be a problem so a good look is simple. Make sure the plug caps pop fully home on the plugs, it's easy to not get them quite fully home (DAMHIK). Any irregular firing faults can cause irregular running and can make it sound "tockety". Once running again, check carefully for any signs of arcing around the HT leads and caps. one or two instances of this have been reported. Really needs to be in a dark environment (garage etc) but obviously take usual precautions about running engines in closed spaces. You can try using a hand spray bottle of water to see if you get any arcing, the HT leads should be tolerant of water spray.

 

Next, do an ECU "reset", the process is simple (and free). It cannot do any harm even if it doesn't actually achieve anything. Basically disconnect battery for a few minutes, 30mins if you want to be absolutely sure (not critical how long). From cold, start the engine WITHOUT TOUCHING THE THROTTLE. Do not touch it, and allow it to run at idle UNTIL FAN KICKS IN, this takes around 15mins. Stop it using the KILL SWITCH, wait for a short time (maybe 30sec) and then turn the ignition off. Reset the kill switch and you're good to go.

 

Check the battery connections are clean and tightened properly. I'd also check the common earth point at the front left side of the riders seat behind the panels. There are a lot of wires here. Undo the bolt, clean the eyelets, refit and tighten properly.

 

Make sure the oil level is not too high. Bike upright, hot engine and stopped for a couple of minutes, dipstick resting on threads NOT screwed in, oil should NOT be above the max mark. Personally I've always found Castrol Power1 10W30 works nicely, but choose your own poison.

 

I'd also look carefully at the drive chain and sprockets. The original chains can be rather "coarse" in operation. Fitting a new DID VX2 chain to mine made it much smoother feel to ride.

 

I'm not suggesting any or all of these are what your issues may be, but that's the stuff I'd be checking. Remote diagnosis can't be more precise I'm afraid.

 

Mechanically the NC range is proving pretty reliable, so fears of serious issues should be put into perspective.

NO No No

as soon as you start home mechanicing you invalidate any guarantee! Get legal -unless you are a trained mechanic - why give the dealer his mark up if he doesnt honour his side of the deal. The bike ISNT RIGHT - reject it as you are legally right to do until the end of the guarantee period

[Andy m 23,454]

Do Honda offer an extended warranty? I'd take it out, store the paperwork with the dealers no-fault-found report (you want this in writing), then ride it like you stole it.

Your Lawyer may beat the dealers but Honda will kick his bum and hand you the bill for doing it. You'll find they didn't actually sell you the bike or any service, the dealer did, they only promoted the sale from their office in Luxembourg.

Andy

[Tex 36,816]

You have four weeks from the date of first registration to extend the warranty for a further year. It's about £300 or something daft.

[Guest machinman]

What was the outcome?