32k service and head bearings

[rjp996 1,091]

Had a 32,000 service on my NC750x yesterday at 1yr 7 months old. I had raised that at high steering angles in car parks etc, it felt like there was movement in the front end.

Well service done and it looks like the steering bearings have a notch in them and will need replacing.

How long are head bearings normal expected to last (rear wheel bearing only lasted18k), and given im doing close to 28-30k a year on the bike now, wheel bearings and head bearings once a year are going to add up.

Is 32k and 19 months reasonable for head stock bearings or should I be looking to ask if it is a warranty item ?

 

Other than a few tight spots on the chain (that I was aware of), and bit of uneven wear on the front PR4 (that looks to be wearing exactly the same as the previous one), oh.... and a perished read valve stem on a tyre that was only changed and replaced 3 weeks ago, all was good, and I got to buzz around for the day on a CB650 that was a fun and nippy little bike :-)

 

Head bearing is quoted at ~£110 for the kit and 2 hrs work, so another 110 all + vat so not a cheap fix

[Guest bonekicker]

Richard no not cheap-- if you think there could be a warranty claim--then claim--your garage should really advise you if it's possible--but then ??? 

[embee 7,288]

Steering head bearings will last a long time IF they are greased and adjusted properly.

 

That was one of the first things I checked on mine when I got it (used 2k miles). As with my Deauville, which I got new, the adjuster locknuts nuts were not even finger tightened against each other, there was slack between them and just the tab washer secured them. The angular contact ball bearings used by Honda should have quite a bit of preload on them (unlike tapered rollers which just have the free play removed). There was some grease in there but not generous by any means. Honda need to check their assembly process in the factory, it doesn't appear to follow the workshop manual procedure in my experience.

 

Another Deau owner who does courier work adjusts the bearings properly and gets 100k+ miles from them.

[rjp996 1,091]

Thanks for the replies, I will call the dealer tomorrow and ask if it's a warranty item as surely an item such as this is not suppose to wear out within the warranty period (17 odd months). I know 32k may be seen as a lot of miles for a bike but that's only because lots only get used so little, as a product I would expect it to be fit for purpose after 17 months and 32k miles, if a car wheel bearing failed like this it would be included I would think. 

[djsb 491]

What "special" tools are needed for greasing the head bearings. There are loads of these tools mentioned in the service manual but i'm wondering what size of socket and what else is needed to grease the bearings. Do they need to be adjusted or is this all done with shims/washers/spacers?

[embee 7,288]

Arguably no "special" tools, though you need a means of removing and tightening (103Nm) the top yoke cap nut, so a socket really (I think 32mm but need to check), and the castellated adjuster nut and locknut need tightening. These can be done with a suitable C-spanner, although a "special" castle socket tool makes it a lot easier. I made one (two actually since the first one was lent out and disappeared). Some folk even use a flat ended punch or even a screwdriver, though this is tantamount to butchery and I wouldn't recommend it. I re-use the tab washer as long as the tabs show no signs of cracking. The locknuts don't actually need to be tightened against each other very much as long as they are slightly loaded against each other since the cap nut will load them together once fitted, and you'll almost certainly find they are barely finger tight from the factory. It's important to put enough preload on the first castellated nut to load the bearings, I found a suitable value of about 10Nm by feel, the recommended 15Nm (I think) made them a little too tight for my likings. These angular contact ball bearings are designed for this degree of preload, tapered rollers are not.

 

The critical thing is a means of supporting the bike with the front wheel off the ground. A centre stand is the ideal tool. I put a couple of bags of sand on the rear seat to tip it rearwards, and also back it up with suitable blocks under the sump.

 

You can safely fully pack the bearings with grease, the more the merrier, principles of only partially packing bearings only apply to continuously rotating situations.

 

Have  a look at this thread I posted a long time ago

The pics there and this diagram from https://www.bike-parts-honda.com/pieces-honda-detail-71541-71541-NC750XDE-2014-F_07-NC+750+X+ABS+DCT.html should explain it all. I think the bearing cages 8&9 are actually illustrated upside down in the diagram, the photos in my thread show the real life situation.

[Tex 36,817]

19 hours ago, rjp996 said:

Thanks for the replies, I will call the dealer tomorrow and ask if it's a warranty item as surely an item such as this is not suppose to wear out within the warranty period (17 odd months). I know 32k may be seen as a lot of miles for a bike but that's only because lots only get used so little, as a product I would expect it to be fit for purpose after 17 months and 32k miles, if a car wheel bearing failed like this it would be included I would think. 

 

Richard, this is one of those situations where having a dealer service history will go in your favour. Had you serviced it yourself I would bet a weeks pension that Honda would tell you to go a whistle. The phrase they use is something like "A lack of professional servicing has contributed to the fault".

 

But - yay! - they can't say that when you wave your dealer service history at them..

 

Let us know how you get on.

[Guest dcordeiro]

In French but a great guide

 

http://vincentrobic.me/2015/12/03/remplacement-roulements-colonne-direction-honda-nc700x/

[Guest machinman]

The French guide is quite good and traslates well, though I think they removed far too many parts unnecessarily. I did this a couple of years ago and didn't touch any bodywork or dismantle the handlebars. The handlebars were supported and that gave enough room and saves disconnecting anything.

[djsb 491]

Have you got any technical drawings or dimensions for your castle socket? I could possibly get one made at work over next summer if I have sketch of the internal and external diameter of the cylinderical steel tube and the dimensions and spacing and number of the lugs. Also was yours made for a 3/8 socket or a spanner(which size). There are a few of these on the bikers toolbox website but our bike isn't mentioned. Thanks.

[Derek_Mac 1,404]

David, here's a thread that you might find interesting. Have a look at the last post in the thread.

[embee 7,288]

14 hours ago, djsb said:

Have you got any technical drawings or dimensions for your castle socket? I could possibly get one made at work over next summer if I have sketch of the internal and external diameter of the cylinderical steel tube and the dimensions and spacing and number of the lugs. Also was yours made for a 3/8 socket or a spanner(which size). There are a few of these on the bikers toolbox website but our bike isn't mentioned. Thanks.

The easy question first. I welded an old 3/8 drive socket on the end to suit my 3/8 torque wrench which has the right range for that, but you could have whatever you wanted to suit your tools.

Second. I actually have a spare castle nut set which I picked up in a box of bits and bobs from a breakers (all the odd bolts etc from a broken Integra). The tightening nut has 4 slots, the top nut has 8 slots, so make a socket with 4 pegs.

Measuring the nut, the inner pitch circle diameter of the slots is 41mm,

the O/D of the top nut is 45.75mm (the adjuster nut has small lumps next to the slots which make it 46.1mm),

the slot width is 6.15mm,

the nut thickness is 5.57mm

 

I suggest make the 4 pegs 6.0/5.9mm wide (90deg equal spacing) and 5.0mm long..

The tool O/D isn't particularly important, mine is 48.4mm because that is the size of the tube I used but there is clearance all round so could be bigger.

Inner diameter should be around 41.5mm to make sure it isn't a tight fit.

I made it 80mm long overall to give plenty of clearance over the steering stem, I'm not sure of the minimum required.

 

 

 

 

 

[Tex 36,817]

Or take the easy way out.. £20 to you Squire..

 

http://www.gbmotorcycleproducts.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=190_197&product_id=4594

[Guest Hati]

Good on ya Simon, solved it for me too They (same vendor) are on that auction site too, sorts international postage unlike the website.

[djsb 491]

Yes thanks Simon. Just ordered one of these. Just need to find out what size of socket (31mm?) I need for the top fork stem nut before I go any further. Easier asking on here than going out in the freezing cold car park with a bag of tools to check myself. Better get the bearings regreased as I have the forks,wheel  etc off anyway (will replace them the wheel and forks temporaily to get the nut undone). I hadn't planned on servicing the bearings but it seems straightforward enough so I may as well do.

[kharli 100]

just had the steering head bearings done on my 60k miles nc700..amazing difference to cornering. Mine were just notchy but I would have done it earlier had I realized how poor cornering had gradually become.

[wjvh 999]

Anyone know what dimensions are required for roller bearings, steering, NC700S? 

Thanks, Will

[wjvh 999]

Found the measurements on wemoto website; 47mm od top Race and 55mm od bottom race.