Oil Level Check - Right or Wrong?

[Spike 171]

I have just returned home from the Honda dealer after having a "end of warranty check" on my 2015 750s. No problems found accept I was told that the engine level was overfilled and they had drained out about 300ml.

I queried this as I check the oil on a regular basis (as I'm sure we all do).

They told me to check the oil level by screwing the dipstick/oil filler ALL the way in, put the bike in an upright position (no centre stand... yet!) then check the oil level.

However, the manual clearly states to seat the filler cover but NOT to screw it in!

I queried this with them and they consulted with the Service Manager and they told me it must be a misprint in the manual as you should definitely screw the filler cap all the way in.

 

Has anybody else heard this/been aware?  I dont know what to believe now, and 300ml either overfilled or underfilled seems quite a lot! 

[Derek_Mac 1,404]

 I've always done it the way that you do, I suspect they were talking a load of b*ll*cks.

   I just do what it says in the Honda Service manual.

  The only way to check is to actually ask Honda I suppose.

[Andy m 23,472]

Ask for the 300ml of oil back. Your method is right and the oil is your property!

 

I have an "end of warranty service". Its usually at about 3000 miles when I can't be bothered with the dealer and go DIY! 

 

Andy

Edited April 28, 2017 by Andy m

[embee 7,288]

Misprint my asre!

 

Honda state clearly how to check it, no ambiguity. Do what the manual says not some spotty oik on work placement or his idiot suited charlatan boss. Just my opinion.

[steelhorseuk 1,690]

I agree with Murray (embee) and the comments above. The manual is correct.

I always measure the 'exact' amount of oil required as per Honda handbook when I do the oil change.

Then I check again using the dip-stick method described in the manual.

The reading is always within tolerance.

If I put the dipstick all the way home and read the level, it is too high.

Hope that helps.

-Mark-

Edited April 28, 2017 by Smudger

[trisaki 2,029]

Get a new dealer  obviously  a real Dipstick  ! 

[Guest sykospain]

Like the 'dipstick' comment, Mark.

My German video script translator, Delphine in Berlin, also works for the same print-translation agency that produces the rider manuals for BMW Motorrad.  The German ones as well as all the foreign-language versions.

She says the relevant team spends weeks, literally weeks before publication, checking and re-checking the wording of a manual, not just with the factory guys on the other side of town, to make sure everything written is correct mechanical and maintenance information and procedure, but also with the po-faced Armani-suited BMW AG lawyers, to make sure the book is litiginously bombproof in that area too.

I suspect Honda and other major bike makers do the same.

It's safe to assume therefore that the manual is correct - don't screw the dipstick in when checking the oil level with the bike warm and having been stood vertical for a few minutes, just touch it to the start of the thread in the casting.

Edited April 28, 2017 by sykospain

[shiggsy 529]

"...it must be a mis-print in the manual". Sounds like he was operating under his own assumptions otherwise he would have confirmed that it is a mis-print.  Does he have documentation to the contrary ?  If it is a mis-print its in more than one document because it says in the hand book and the workshop manual not to screw the dip-stick in.  I think I'd be telling them they are wrong and either correct the oil level the way it says in the manual or give you the oil to do it your self.

[Tex 36,816]

I'm horrified to see this. Really. Every bike those clowns service is going out a third of a litre short of oil.. Starts with 'W' and rhymes with 'anchors'..

 

Some Triumphs (and others) require the dipstick to be screwed in, but a bloody dealer should know what's what.

[Derek_Mac 1,404]

The big question really is, who's the dealer in question?

 

Edit: Bransons or Fowlers at a guess

Edited April 28, 2017 by Derek_Mac

[Defender 3,834]

Note to dealer:-

RTFM!

[Grumpy old man 4,670]

£60 an hour. Shake my head.

[coopers12345 99]

6 hours ago, embee said:

Misprint my asre!

 

Honda state clearly how to check it, no ambiguity. Do what the manual says not some spotty oik on work placement or his idiot suited charlatan boss. Just my opinion.

 

The manual isn't always right though. The service manual states that the cam sprocket should line up with the top mark when checking the valve clearances but it's actually the bottom, otherwise it sounds like a sack of spanners.

[Slowboy 20,352]

But the case of the oil level check the manual is absolutely correct. My service manual, paper copy bought direct from Honda, must have been corrected re valve clearances.

Very disappointing that your dealer should not know this about their product.

[CFB 4,601]

The manual is correct, I would put money on it.

I have owned a dozen Hondas and the manual for every single one stated the oil level should be checked with the dipstick NOT screwed in but resting on the lip of the filler thread.

 

[Spike 171]

So could there be any damage caused by this "error" ?!

[Andy m 23,472]

It increases the chance of a problem. If the bike burns or leaks a bit you have to spot it sooner. The oil is working harder so will be worn out earlier. In most cases you could double the oil change interval,so no problem, but if you are in the 1% where 8000 is the correct interval you may be reducing the engine life. Modern engines are very tough and marketing concerns have caused them to have much more intensive servicing than they need but it isn't a good thing to do. My biggest concern is that if this dealer doesn't know such basic info, what else have they stuffed up?

 

Andy

[trisaki 2,029]

If the level of the oil when checked by the dipstick!   screwing  your dipstick  in ,was between the two lines then no real harm should come to your engine especially  if you  hadn't driven far    all Honda,s that I have known  have oil checked by laying  the dipstick  on top of filler hole not screwed  in  -new dealer please and maybe a email to Honda  get poppet on the case 

[michael 324]

I suppose the other method to verify oil is the capacity at oil changes. Using the dealer's or the Operator's Manual as a guideline, the measured oil going into the engine would lead us to the same conclusion the OM is correct - the tech (I use this term in the broader sense) may be confusing Honda procedure with another brand……….

[Andy m 23,472]

Isn't measuring drained oil volume covered on day 1 of mechanics school? If you put back the same volume you have a starting point where adjusting the level to the middle of the dipstick/ window should only involve putting oil in. Taking oil out involves playing with copper washers and risking a stripped drain plug thread.

 

Andy

[CFB 4,601]

3 hours ago, Andy m said:

Isn't measuring drained oil volume covered on day 1 of mechanics school? If you put back the same volume you have a starting point where adjusting the level to the middle of the dipstick/ window should only involve putting oil in. Taking oil out involves playing with copper washers and risking a stripped drain plug thread.

 

Andy

 

Unless it was overfilled before you drain it. 😋

[Andy m 23,472]

Excess tends to blow out of breather holes. When you've warmed the engine (also day 1 stuff) you'll have been looking round for the streaks.

 

Guzzi and BMW forums are good for this game. Fiddlers the lot of them and likely to top up the oil everytime it drops below the thickness of the top line on the stick or glass. The ones with slopeing driveways will see hundreds of ml oil "consumption" and be lead into goodness knows what in terms taking the thing to bits (they love it). When you run them on the middle line oil consumption drops to zero. Its a miracle (with help from flat shallow sumps) !

 

Andy

Edited May 2, 2017 by Andy m

[Guest klauzero]

 

That's it.

 

[fj_stuart 4,739]

When I got my CBF250 this was one of the first things I checked in the manual. The level is checked with the dipstick screwed OUT.

 

Not a problem on my other bikes (FJ1200/SV650) they have a great invention - a sight window!

[SteveThackery 3,090]

Gotta concur with everyone else: the instructions are perfectly clear.  You use the dipstick without screwing it in.