Muppets

[sullspots 52]

First service at Hunts Manchester on my NC750X

 

Being new to the bike and not knowing the ins ands outs,all I knew was that the mpg dropped from low 80's to low 70's and the bike felt a bit "lethargic"

 

Checked the oil and the level came right up to the round bit of the dipstick.I undid the drain plug and drained off almost a whole litre of oil...

 

 

What is the point of using dealers to service our bikes?The bike was a PCP purchase and I'm now beginning to doubt if Honda have the dealer network to back up their sales promises.I was considering chopping in the NC for an Africa Twin but will probs now look more towards the Teutonic offerings?? 

 

 

[DaveM59 1,603]

You're not the first and definitely won't be the last to fall foul of incompetent dealer servicing. I know mistakes happen and errors will be made occasionally but it seems that no one double checks anything or seems to be able to be left alone to concentrate on the job in hand these days. DIY is the only real way to know for certain that a job has been done properly and even on a new bike where you are keeping up warranty requirements, if they screw up and something goes wrong they will always deny it so the warranty is pretty worthless anyway.

[Rocker66 34,375]

Don't agree that the warranty is useless as both Sue and I have had work done under it with no problems. Sue even had the frame of her Hornet replaced after the warranty had expired. Due to a known problem with the Altanator on the CBF they replaced them on bikes up to seven years old. Only last week we met a guy at Kent M/Cs who had reported a small split in the seat cover of his VFR1200. Due to the distance he lives from the dealer he had only had to email them a picture of the seat. He just walked in with the old seat and out with a brand new one. Again no arguments.

Im sure their are dealers who don't do a good job but there are also those that do. I have posted before about the excellent service I got from Lloyds in Carlisle who got me back on the road very quickly and saved my holiday despite the fact I was a complete stranger to them.

[Guest aldmannie]

1 hour ago, sullspots said:

will probs now look more towards the Teutonic offerings??

 

FFS don't do that, they're even worse.

[Fatbob 453]

Look at the colour of that sludge. 

[alhendo1 3,031]

1 hour ago, sullspots said:

First service at Hunts Manchester on my NC750X

 

Being new to the bike and not knowing the ins ands outs,all I knew was that the mpg dropped from low 80's to low 70's and the bike felt a bit "lethargic"

 

Checked the oil and the level came right up to the round bit of the dipstick.I undid the drain plug and drained off almost a whole litre of oil...

 

 

What is the point of using dealers to service our bikes?The bike was a PCP purchase and I'm now beginning to doubt if Honda have the dealer network to back up their sales promises.I was considering chopping in the NC for an Africa Twin but will probs now look more towards the Teutonic offerings?? 

 

 

That is absolutely outrageous. ....

[embee 7,288]

1 hour ago, Fatbob said:

Look at the colour of that sludge. 

Exactly.

 

Regardless of the level, if the oil has just been changed it should look clear and bright, either golden yellow or red depending on what they use, but definitely not shi**y brown/black crud like that. Looks like someone has simply added a load of new oil without draining the old out.

[Guest bonekicker]

Honda UK should do random-- undercover checks on the dealers not following the rules-- this bad servicing thread goes from bad to worst--we pay top dollar--sorry pound for the PDI check -- the short mileage first service --then regular services--yes and checking the tappets-- please send a complaint to Honda --it may make them look-- at the bad dealers and kick their arses--we know there are Good and Bad --But they should all be Good Surely--it's very basic mechanics after all--changing oil and filter. 

[Andy m 23,473]

I would be quoting the Consumer Rights Act on a registered post letter to a director of that dealership and suggesting life will be less complicated for him if he refunds what you paid and adds thd cost of the replacement oil.

 

Broken Motorcycles Worldwide inc. invented this level of service. If you want **** buy a chinese moped off the auction site. Its going to be better made and less expensive when petrol and matches is the only thing that's going to preserve your sanity.

 

Andy

[horobags 905]

I use hunts and have done for years. If I were you John I'd be on the phone to them tuesday morning. This workmanship is unaceptable, and the service manager (andy) really needs to know about this. That is not new oil.!!

[Andy m 23,473]

BTW I do hope you plan to wash the measuring jug before tea time

 

Andy

[trisaki 2,029]

Basically the same level of service poppet got from her dealer  when I checked it over the day after the service too much oil (not changed ) dangerously tight drive chain and over inflated tyres - apart from that everything was fine ie they didnt touch anything else  / should get better service from Honda  believe she got a full refund 

[Finlayson99 1,009]

Not sure where in the North West you are but for what it's worth, I use Bill Smith's in Chester. Ian there is a top bloke IMHO, always happy to help and give honest advice. He's at their Honda branch.

Good luck, that deffo looks like old sludge to me.

[Tonyj 6,907]

Was that a litre too much in the bike ? That is impressive. Didn't know they took that much , the seals must've have been like Mr creosote. Waffer thin mint please. :0)

[commuter 262]

I always have disliked trusting others with the servicing of my vehicles. With classic vehicles, I have always been able to complete all of my own servicing. With modern vehicles they deliberately build items in to make diy servicing more difficult. Computer software to read fault codes is the prime example. However, fault code reading should never be necessary right? Why would the industry want to make it difficult for me to read a fault code? It almost an admission that the vehicle they are selling to me will break non service parts as a matter of course in order to guarantee ongoing business for the appointed agents. 

 A thought I have when sales people ask me whether I would like to buy an extended warranty on new equipment is, " Why are they charging money for this?Don't they have the confidence in their product to just offer the warranty for a completely fixed term after which reliability can't be guaranteed?" 

I never ever buy extended warranty on anything. I do a lot of reading before I buy and when i read stories of how the extended warranty saved the day, I look elsewhere.

Admittedly, the engine oil drained from this bike doesn't look good for just being a few miles old, however I know that different engines can keep their oil in different ways. I had a triumph which always had black oil 5 minutes after an oil change.I even tried doing short oil changes to try to clear out the system changing the oil every week for 5 weeks to no avail! My mate had a Volkswagon Sciroco which always had lovely amber coloured oil even when he'd forgotten to change it.

It is very worrying that an appointed dealer managed to over fill the bike. Sounds like you need to invest in one of those little touch up pots of white paint so that you can just put tiny spots onto critical joints which you would expect to be broken during routine servicing.

[PoppetM 16,831]

5 hours ago, trisaki said:

Basically the same level of service poppet got from her dealer  when I checked it over the day after the service too much oil (not changed ) dangerously tight drive chain and over inflated tyres - apart from that everything was fine ie they didnt touch anything else  / should get better service from Honda  believe she got a full refund 

 

You forgot wheel alignment too. It kept pitching to one side. Utterly terrifying after only just passing my test. Andy still won't follow me on the bike after that ride down to Sussex behind me. 

 

I did indeed get a full refund without needing to get "heavy" and didn't need to use my works email address "law firm". The response from the service manager: "my mechanic has told me if you are saying he didn't do it, he probably didn't. Do what card do you want it refunded to?"

 

My husband is still very thankful you spotted it the following day when we came to Whiteways, as am I. 

 

I wont ever go to that dealer again for service.

[Andy m 23,473]

12 hours ago, commuter said:

.....With modern vehicles they deliberately build items in to make diy servicing more difficult. Computer software to read fault codes is the prime example. However, fault code reading should never be necessary right? Why would the industry want to make it difficult for me to read a fault code?

 

.......... " Why are they charging money for this?Don't they have the confidence in their product to just offer the warranty for a completely fixed term after which reliability can't be guaranteed?" 

 

I'll come at this from another angle, I work in the industry just on heavy vehicles.

 

The aim on the OE side is to reduce costs. Software is fantastic. Instead of three valves with three settings each, made by setting up a production line each time you switch variants, make one valve continuously and put a different programme in. Keep one as a spare and programme it when you change it.

 

If you have the right kit the diagnostic stuff is childs play. Put the laptop on and it tells you which valve or cable it has a problem with. No more using your brain, blowing smoke down pipes etc. Its getting better as I can connect remotely to the most modern vehicles. Diagnosis by the national accounts manager with 25 years experience and the pit monkeys there only as cheap alternatives to robots (Stephen Fry is right on a lot of this BTW, don't be a pit monkey if you want to be earning good money in 2030).

 

Servicing is only more difficult if you try and fix a computer with woodworking tools and farming implements.

 

Service codes are intellectual property. We did the work, we know them, we can charge you. If you have to give these away, why not force manufacturers to give out CD's with the manufacturing drawings on so you can get knock off parts made too? If this happens we will need to make our living only on the vehicles so you will pay more then be on your own with only the published information. Compare the price of a cut throat razor with disposable and the skill required to hone one, its the original business model for this.

 

Every item has a life. There are variations in production. Just by having the thinnest wire allowed in the biggest crimp allowed that connection will fail sooner than others. You can tighten the tolerances but create a cost. The market won't pay double for a 1% reduction in failure rate (unless they are the Army in which case they'll pay triple for parts no one will keep in stock). Our end of line failure rate BTW is 2 parts in a million.

 

Warranty is just a marketing tool. Buy my product and if it fails in 2 years I'll repair it. BTW, you have to pay me over the odds to service it and if I say you broke it the deal is off. Would you like a 5 year warranty (excludes wear and tear). The money you make on tied servicing more than covers what you pay out. Your accountants will push you to reject all claims. If you buy say 2000 vehicles at a time, you will find the warranty rules and service requirements can become much more flexible. A purely commecial situation where you balance expected failure rate, money made on service and repeat business. So long as your competitors have similar models its a cartel, his hacked off customers come to you and vice versa.

 

Andy

 

[Tonyj 6,907]

Wise words o guru :0) btw what is a cut throat razor and can I 3d print one :0)

[Andy m 23,473]

Cut throat razor: an offensive weapon as defined by the Treat Everyone Like Children (I saw Sweeney Todd on the telly last night) Act 2007. 

 

Yes, you can 3d print one but good luck getting an edge on it. Be sure to e-mail the printer file to any American friends (who can send you the one shot cartridge firing device one by return), anyone you know who works at an airport or anyone detained at Her Majestys Pleasure. It will make their day (and possibly yours) more memorable.

 

Andy

[wingrider.steve 943]

I had dealings with "*unts" a few years ago and I was left with the definite feeling that the dealers name was a misprint!!!

 

[XXX 2,697]

45 minutes ago, wingrider.steve said:

I had dealings with "*unts" a few years ago and I was left with the definite feeling that the dealers name was a misprint!!!

 

You know how it is with autocorrect. Sometimes you just can't get your device to write what you really want to write. 😜

[Rocker66 34,375]

3 hours ago, Tonyj said:

Wise words o guru :0) btw what is a cut throat razor and can I 3d print one :0)

That question has really made me feel old.😀

They were allegedly the favourite weapon of the Teddy Boys. Now go on ask what a Teddy Boy was LOL

[embee 7,288]

3 hours ago, Andy m said:

 

I'll come at this from another angle, I work in the industry just on heavy vehicles. ...................

 

Just for interest, in the car industry we had a highly technical measure for reliability in service, it was known as "TGW". The benchmark for good cars at the time was low single figure numbers per hundred vehicles, the likes of Honda and Lexus were in the 5-8 bracket, other more troublesome makes could be in three figure territory (i.e. every car had at least one TGW).

 

What did TGW stand for?

 

"Things gone wrong"

 

Seems a very crude description but in the real world it's what the customer experiences, something has gone wrong. It doesn't matter much to them whether it's a stuck switch or a con-rod through the block, it still means inconvenience and annoyance at having to get it fixed (under warranty).

[Tonyj 6,907]

No rocker your safe with not having to explain about teddy boys . They were the immaculately dressed well coiffured exapalary mannered young men and women who chose a music that God listens to , from the fifties. Not the other lot , the ones covered in oil . :0)

[Defender 3,834]

I always check my bike after it's been serviced, we can all make mistakes and after having a bike engine fail as it didn't have sufficient oil in it after a service, many many years ago!