Engineer/mechanic advice requested please

[Graham NZ 1,186]

13 hours ago, larryblag said:

What's "Estoppel"? Sounds German for brakes. "And to halt da vehicle you press Estoppel, heavy like".

 

Estoppel is a legal principle which prevents an action at an in-appropriate time.  Eg.  An architect specifies that a roof be painted red.  When he visits the site the roof is being painted green but he says nothing to the contractor and goes away to think about it.  Later he condemns the green paint and requires the contractor to re-paint the roof red as specified.  The contractor claims estoppel, which is upheld by an arbitrator, and the architect is required to accept the green roof because he should have stopped the contractor when he first saw the incorrect paint being applied.  Been there.  Know that.

[Rocker66 34,351]

10 hours ago, kayz1 said:

I don't think there are built in Italy, think they were designed in Italy and made in Japan,

At least All mine ( 2x Integra  1X 750X and 1x X-ADV )have all said made in Japan on them....

Is Honda tellin fibs!

But they are all NC models not the SH300 under discussion.

[Trev 18,533]

On 11/17/2017 at 16:12, Tonyj said:

trev I still want a corvette  c3 I think it's model number was . If I had a garage I would have one . Totally crass ,underpowered all plastic but   Shaped like a shark and pointy with big old arches . When I was a kid I thought why would you buy a hillman hunter when this exists :0)

I like them to be fair, a friend is considering selling his Range Rover but his misses is staying firm so he is waiting . He's done the configuration thing already. Me I keep driving past the Datsun shop , got my beady eye on a gt-r

 

I'm with you on the Corvette, great looking car but I was drawn to the Mustang as it's the first time Ford (or I believe any other US manufacturer)  has produced a UK spec, right hand drive version of a muscle car, or at least one I could afford! I thought long and hard about the GTR, even tried one out (devastating perfromance) but the combination of (much) higher cost and totally different character kept bringing me back to the Mustang.  Pretty sure I wouldn't have been back to the Nissan dealer for a new motor though if I had gone for a GTR 

 

Your friend may be disappointed if he (or his wife) chose the R.Rover for it's interior or it's 'image' (I never quite get why so many people buy a car to portray to people they nothing about cars ) but they might just get better mpg out of Mustang 

[larryblag 14,236]

Apparently the straight four engine in the Mustang - though very good, just isn't a V8 and thus a disappointment. Like adding a bit too much water to your single malt.

If you can only afford the 4 cylinder,  perhaps look at something else?

The Red one in the film "I am leg end" with Will Smith I like very much. That one might be a Shelby though. 

[larryblag 14,236]

1 hour ago, Rocker66 said:

But they are all NC models not the SH300 under discussion.

Thanks Graham, I've learned something today. An excellent example too, if you don't want a green roof - push hard on the estoppel pedal 

Edited November 19, 2017 by larryblag

[Guest bonekicker]

Well lets all catch a breath for just a moment-- Right thats enough---continue !!!  

[Trev 18,533]

4 hours ago, larryblag said:

Apparently the straight four engine in the Mustang - though very good, just isn't a V8 and thus a disappointment. Like adding a bit too much water to your single malt.

If you can only afford the 4 cylinder,  perhaps look at something else?

The four pot is the 2.3L 313 bhp motor used in the Focus ST so not exactly slow (or eco!). Apparently Ford thought that conservative, eco minded Brits would prefer the 4 cyl over the V8 and initially shipped it about 2 to 1 to the V8 but of course most people, including me, who want a Mustang, do so because of that burbling V8 and the actual sales ratio has been about 3 to 1 in favour of the V8 and I wouldn't mind betting that dealers have had to heavily discount many of those 4 cylinders cars as well. With some serious haggling you could probably get an ex-demo  2.3 manual coupe, in a less favoured colour for not much more than £30k,

[larryblag 14,236]

That'll be a beige one for me then?

[Trev 18,533]

12 minutes ago, larryblag said:

That'll be a beige one for me then?

 

 don't think they do beige but there are a couple of pretty forgettable dark blues and reds and of course the inevitable dark grey that lets the shape blend in with the German herd if you want your Mustang less crass .... but then, a bit like the 4 cylinder engine, what would be the point of that 

[Tex 36,816]

I had no idea a 4 cylinder Mustang even existed! Who thought that would be a good idea? Some things are just, plain, wrong.  

[Jeffprince 4,921]

16 hours ago, Tex said:

I had no idea a 4 cylinder Mustang even existed! Who thought that would be a good idea? Some things are just, plain, wrong.  

James May said that anyone in the States who bought one was considered a communist, in his programme on post war cars.

[Tex 36,816]

A communist? Why? Not seeing a connection..  

[Jeffprince 4,921]

....as in someone unacceptable in US society at the time.

[Tex 36,816]

32 minutes ago, Jeffprince said:

....as in someone unacceptable in US society at the time.

 

Ah! Yes. Obvious really.  

[Mister Paul 838]

Update:

 

I replied to Honda's offer of an extra year's warranty. In their email they said that there would only have been a "minor oil weep" from the error, so I sent them photos of the bottom of the sump with more than a weep's worth on, and said that there was staining on the floor at home and at work, and that there was evidence of oil and water mixing. And that the head and bores had been examined, but nothing else had been inspected. I pinched some of Tex's wording about doubts about long-term effects of the error, and said that I would prefer that the engine be replaced. I also pointed out that the extended warranty ties me in to Honda servicing for another year.

 

They have replied and repeated that they do not feel that the error will have resulted in further damage, and said that they will not replace the engine. They acknowledge my point about servicing costs and have now offered one free service in addition to the extended warranty. They've also given me details of the National Conciliation Service and suggested that I contact them if I'm not happy with this.

 

I'm torn as to whether to leave it as it is, or push for me to be returned to a position where I would have been had they fitted a gasket in the first place (resale value and reassurance of no long-term damage).

[Tex 36,816]

I have made my feelings quite clear from the outset. The mistake has been rectified and I don’t believe any long term damage will have been suffered.

 

The bike is better now than it was when new. What’s not to like?

 

As to the re-sale value, how has that been affected? You will just part exchange it in the usual way, surely? 

 

I’m not really surprised Honda don’t want to give you an engine, I wouldn’t either!

 

We can now expect howls of protest from the ‘you got rights!’ brigade..  

[Mister Paul 838]

The lingering bit is if I should sell privately and a prospective buyer asks about its history. If that was me I'd walk away if I was told that it was built and run for 1800 miles with no head gasket. I'm not one of those who milks compensation, I just don't want to find myself out of pocket, and I need to get rid of the doubts. 

[Andy m 23,427]

The refference to the concilliation service is code for take the deal or talk to their lawyers. 

 

I would trade back to the same dealer as first choice, then another Honda dealer who can read the service history. If I was buying, I would ask, I would expect you to tell me and would indeed walk away if there was another bike otherwise the same without this history. If the price,location and condition otherwise met my needs I'd buy it.

 

Ride it for a year. If it breaks claim on the warranty again. If it doesn't, you can tell the next bloke you've put 6000 miles on it with no hassle. Tells a better story when selling.

 

Andy

[fred_jb 10,263]

1 hour ago, Tex said:

I have made my feelings quite clear from the outset. The mistake has been rectified and I don’t believe any long term damage will have been suffered.

 

The bike is better now than it was when new. What’s not to like?

 

You may well be right Tex on a purely logical level, but at the emotional level it is not your feelings that matter, and if Paul still feels aggrieved then I have a lot of sympathy for that.

 

Not quite sure how it is better than new as it now has a black mark on its history that a new bike wouldn't have.

[Tex 36,816]

Well, it now has a gasket that it didn’t have when it was new. So it’s better, no?  

 

We get far too silly over things like this (not saying Paul is, just ‘westerners’ generally). I recall a thread on a Triumph forum where a guy had 3 rusty spokes on a Bonnie. There’s 36 spokes in each wheel, so 3 rusty ones were a failure of less than 5%. Triumph offered to replace all the spokes in both wheels (I would have been happy to just replace the 3). Not good enough! He wanted 2 new wheels (including hubs and rims) and something for the ‘disress’ caused. 

 

 

[Andy m 23,427]

We are raised from being very small to be proud of and take care of our "stuff". Add that its one of the most expensive items you will buy and you can understand such feelings can get beyond the logic that its now fixed and almost certainly fine.

 

My Father-in-law washes the repmobile. He just cannot understand my attitude that this newish car is about as personal to me as the lathe he used to drive. I take care of my bikes as the depreciation comes out of the budget for my next one.

 

Andy

[Trev 18,533]

IMO it depends quite a lot on what you plan to do with the bike, if you're going to sell it in a few months then I would push for a replacement motor (although like Tex I don't think you'll get it), if you're going to keep it for a couple of years then you have a bike that's 'better than new' as I assume it didn't come with an extended warranty and free service from new. I would however push to make sure that the free service is the 'big one' with valve clearance check, etc

 

Having the extra security of the extended warranty is good peace of mind and if it runs past that without any issues then I would not feel the need to reveal it to any future buyer unless they specifically ask whether it was supplied from new without a head gasket - unlikely.

 

Having been a through a similar experience recently it is difficult not to listen to those who say 'you deserve such and such for the inconvenience/distress/emotional turmoil/etc' but in reality only you know what stress, if any, it's caused you. Mine was a 'toy' so apart from the hassle of breaking down and having to drop-off/collect and deal with a few dozen calls and emails it wasn't really much hassle,  although I know for some people that can seem like the end of the world , we're all different

 

 

[steelhorseuk 1,679]

For great customer service and an industry reputation to exceed the competition in these days of social media the companies need to go the extra mile to satisfy whatever the customer deems to be a happy resolve.

 

if Mr Paul wants a new engine then that is what they should make sure happens and that he is satisfied and he gains confidence in his purchase and removes his well justified doubts. Then he may buy another bike from Honda in the future and tell his mates hey, Honda are great at customer service when things go wrong! What is an engine to Honda ? Very good publicity that's what it is!

 

Every single sale and customer is important and that the consumers hard earned money matters.

 

The guys wearing the suits counting the beans will rub their collective hands in joy that the consumer is a push-over if we do not make it known what is a proper resolve and take them on for it. One man matters! one bike matters!

 

I took on Honda over problems with my bike and after some hassle they capitulated and did what I wanted. I will add that my dealer helped to push them so I know I was not asking for something I was not entitled to. 

 

It's easy to walk into another showroom with your hard earned, never go back and tell everyone on the internet (rightly or wrongly) that Honda are crap for refusing this new engine.

(whether you think that or not)

 

If I go and stand next to the Honda exhibition at the NEC and tell every potential buyer I bought one of these but it never had a head gasket fitted I wonder what most peoples reaction would be ? 

 

-Mark-

 

  

[fred_jb 10,263]

1 hour ago, Andy m said:

 

My Father-in-law washes the repmobile. He just cannot understand my attitude that this newish car is about as personal to me as the lathe he used to drive. I take care of my bikes as the depreciation comes out of the budget for my next one.

 

Andy

Same here - I have a technology fund for tech toys, cameras, and now my latest obsession, bikes.  Only a certain amount of money is allowed to go into this fund, my tech allowance if you like, so I try very hard to get a better than average deal when buying, and look after my stuff, so as to get the lowest possible loss when selling.  With some camera gear I've even managed to turn a small profit!  Sadly, never on a bike!

[Andy m 23,427]

Now you've made me get the calculator out🤔😞🤔😁

 

I fell out with the Bungling Mud Wrestlers in 2003. Prior to that I'd had three new bikes and one second hand. Let stick to the new ones and say I spent £20k in 9 years. They roughly made say £2k on that (10% margin). They ****ed me off over a design issue so would have had to spend £500 to repair my last bike then give me a very good trade in on another model that employed non-chocolate-fireguard designs. Since then I've bought lets say 4 bikes that had equivalents in their range (so another GS instead of the Weestrom, but no substitute for the Enfield or XT, F800 when it replaced the F650 etc.). I'd have spent £35k (please don't tell the wife 😓😢😓😓😣), so £3k plus clear after they paid out. Lets discount all the people who might have been daft enough to listen to my opinions either way.

 

A waterpump cost the B****y Minded W****** £214 a year in lost sales.

 

Now, if I'd wanted an engine, they'd have had to make it and fit it for under £2500 to get back into the black in a decade.

 

I doubt they miss my business.

 

Andy