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Ashley

Do you find the NC750X suspension hard?

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Ashley

Hiya

 

After the lovely, considered and friendly responses I got to my last daft question, I thought I'd pose another ...

 

I've been spoilt riding pillion on my hubbies GS1200 which seems to float over bumps and potholes, so I'm finding the NC750X's suspension quite hard.  Is this a general opinion, or is it just me being "precious"?  

 

I recently read an article about an NC750 which had had the suspension upgraded (Rally Raid) and it apparently made quite a difference. Is upgrading the suspension a common tweak, or am I just finding it harsh as I'm not that experienced a rider and it feels harder and bumpier than the hubbies BMW?  If this is a common occurrence, what seems to be the favoured option please?

 

Many thanks - you guys are lovely and it's refreshing to find a forum where posts don't quickly become nasty.

 

Ashley

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baben

I moved on from the NC partly because of the suspension which, on the mark ones, was harsh at the front and indifferent at the back. It is fixable though and there are a range of fixes from cheap to expensive - the guys on the forum are experts on them. If you don't want to do the work yourself someone like MCT in Stowmarket are very good and will make a good job of it for you

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Tex

Not a daft question, Ashley. And I don’t think you’re being ‘precious’ (love that phrase :D ) at all. You may well find you adapt to it after a short while, but it’s certainly worth checking the pre-load setting on the rear shock to make sure it’s not set any harder than it needs to be for your weight. 

 

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Ashley

Thanks Tex

 

How hard is it to adjust the preload?  Is it something that needs a bit of muscle?  I ride the DCT 'cos I have arthritis in my hands, so I'm dubious about wielding spanners in hard to reach places.

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gonzo

5  min job ash mr ashley or dealer will do it for you im sure  !

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Tex
1 hour ago, Ashley said:

Thanks Tex

 

How hard is it to adjust the preload?  Is it something that needs a bit of muscle?  I ride the DCT 'cos I have arthritis in my hands, so I'm dubious about wielding spanners in hard to reach places.

 

In 2016 the shock adjustment changed to a ‘cam’ type, Ashley. It’s easy enough, but, as Graham says, I would suggest you get someone to show you how the first time. There’s probably a YouTube video on how to do it - I’ll have a look.. :) 

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neojynx

I have a 2015.  I dont find it hard, I just find its crap.  

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Rocker66

Ashley the difference between the suspension on your bike and that on your husbands is simply down to the price of the bikes. Yours is far more basic than his. Having said that as others suggest try adjusting yours before paying out on different units. If your still not happy there are several options of aftermarket units which can help. Please remember if you change the rear unit you will probably find it best to have the forks modified as well. It may even pay to have a suspension expert set it up for your weight and riding style. Plenty of info on this forum and elsewhere on the net. I hope you get it sorted enough to make you happy.

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Trumpet
Posted (edited)

The rear is ok solo, once you set the spring preload for your weight and comfort. It shouldn't feel harsh. The front is harsh, undersprung and over damped. Certainly is on my 2017 model. If you ever ride two up you will realise the rear is not up to it, even with the preload wound up. Bit like a pogo stick and way too soft.

Edited by Trumpet

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skorpion
9 hours ago, Trumpet said:

The rear is ok solo, once you set the spring preload for your weight and comfort. It shouldn't feel harsh. The front is harsh, undersprung and over damped. Certainly is on my 2017 model. If you ever ride two up you will realise the rear is not up to it, even with the preload wound up. Bit like a pogo stick and way too soft.

 

+1

My 2017 rear suspension I find is ok solo for my 16 stone (not needed to adjust) but the front forks are a different story, as Trumpet say's far too harsh, it's the high speed damping thats wrong though mine seems to have eased slightly over the first 1300 miles.

 

I contacted Honda about it and they said they have not had any complaint's.:shocked:

 

I don't agree the problem is because the bike is inexpensive, the problem is a mismatch of spring and damping rates, not cost.:no:

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Rocker66
3 hours ago, skorpion said:

 

+1

My 2017 rear suspension I find is ok solo for my 16 stone (not needed to adjust) but the front forks are a different story, as Trumpet say's far too harsh, it's the high speed damping thats wrong though mine seems to have eased slightly over the first 1300 miles.

 

I contacted Honda about it and they said they have not had any complaint's.:shocked:

 

I don't agree the problem is because the bike is inexpensive, the problem is a mismatch of spring and damping rates, not cost.:no:

My point is a more expensive bike is more likely to have better quality suspension with more adjustability. 

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Morph

My 2017 NC was easy to alter the shock preload - using the supplied D spanner, there are 7 notches for adjustment.  You don't need anything else to simply turn the spanner - it fits easily round the top of the shock ring.  You can see the vertical pin position here (mine is at the lowest position), and it slips up or down that ridged slope which adjusts the preload.  For me, I used it to lower the seat a bit primarily - as this is my first bike I have nothing to compare the bounce to, so ... it seems fine to me :-)

 

20170729_185733-2.jpg.03cff7390147ea83bc39ea481bd90a2f.jpg

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SteveThackery
Posted (edited)
On 01/03/2018 at 15:58, Tex said:

Not a daft question, Ashley. And I don’t think you’re being ‘precious’ (love that phrase :D ) at all. You may well find you adapt to it after a short while, but it’s certainly worth checking the pre-load setting on the rear shock to make sure it’s not set any harder than it needs to be for your weight. 

 

 

Now, now, Tex, you should know better!

 

The preload makes no difference at all to the hardness/stiffness of the ride.  It just raises or lowers the back end of the bike.  Its job is to let you set the correct amount of sag for the weight of the particular rider/passenger.  The correct amount of sag is usually taken to be about 1/3rd of the total travel from fully topped out.

 

If you want a softer ride you need a softer spring.

 

Edited by SteveThackery
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Tex

in a strictly scientific/engineering sense you’re right Steve (as we both know). But ask anyone who has experience of the old air head Beemers about the perceived differences in pre-load. Your bum feels that it’s softer even if your head is arguing that it can’t be. :) 

 

Much more easily demonstrated on the later (cam adjustable) shocks than the early ones, but go out and have a twiddle with the spanners then tell me I’m wrong. :D 

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Morph
16 hours ago, SteveThackery said:

 

The preload makes no difference at all to the hardness/stiffness of the ride.  It just raises or lowers the back end of the bike.  Its job is to let you set the correct amount of sag for the weight of the particular rider/passenger.  The correct amount of sag is usually taken to be about 1/3rd of the total travel from fully topped out.

 

 

Until I read on here....I thought that adjusting it either tightened or loosened the spring - that's what it "appears" to do when you look at it as a lay person.  The top of the spring moves up or down and unless you look underneath at the same time, you don't see the bottom of the shock doing the same thing.  I had thought it was fixed at the base (a bit like a car's).

 

I'll get me coat...

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SteveThackery

I'm going to work on a written explanation with a diagram or two, I think.  I agree it's quite hard to visualise.

 

By the way, my claim that the preload makes no difference to ride "hardnesss" isn't in dispute amongst the experts.  The easiest book to help understand it is Tony Foale's Motorcycling Handling and Chassis Design.  A more thorough explanation is given in Motorcycle Design and Technology: How and Why by G. Cocco, 2005.  

 

The most comprehensive analysis has been given in Motorcycle Dynamics, by V. Cossalter, 2006.  However, you need a good head for maths with that book.

 

The latter two books are both available on Amazon.  For some reason Tony Foale has never reprinted his book, but you can buy a PDF from him or download a pirate copy off the Internet.

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suffolk58

I tend to agree with Rocker here, the original suspension is cheap and fairly nasty.

I had the front rebuilt and a Nitron shock fitted at quite some expense, at MCT (as Glendon mentions above) and a very good investment it has been.

Darren at MCT mentioned the original shock was completely worn out by 20,000 miles, and only fit for scrap.

However, even BMW shocks don't last forever, and when they do need replacing, are much more expensive....ask me how I know. :)

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SteveThackery
Posted (edited)

By the way, although I don't think altering the preload will help, I'm with almost everyone else so far in this thread: the suspension feels too hard.

 

I didn't used to think that, but reading through other threads on the topic and comparing my bike with others, I think it could and should be a lot more comfortable (bearing in mind it's not a flat-out sports bike but an all-purpose workhorse).

 

Edited by SteveThackery

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Morph
16 minutes ago, suffolk58 said:

I tend to agree with Rocker here, the original suspension is cheap and fairly nasty.

I had the front rebuilt and a Nitron shock fitted at quite some expense, at MCT (as Glendon mentions above) and a very good investment it has been.

Darren at MCT mentioned the original shock was completely worn out by 20,000 miles, and only fit for scrap.

However, even BMW shocks don't last forever, and when they do need replacing, are much more expensive....ask me how I know. :)

 

Wow. £438!  I had no idea...

 

That pic tho :( 

 

It looks like if you rotate that screw at the top of the spring (which I assume is what you do to adjust preload) it is  surely... going to compress the spring! Which sorta confuses me again.

 

U542180_19_m-14-40-gs-d1-l-bearing_new.j

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baben
32 minutes ago, Morph said:

Wow. £438!  I had no idea...

Try googling shocks for BMWs......

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slowboy
4 hours ago, Morph said:

 

Wow. £438!  I had no idea...

 

That pic tho :( 

 

It looks like if you rotate that screw at the top of the spring (which I assume is what you do to adjust preload) it is  surely... going to compress the spring! Which sorta confuses me again.

 

 

That's it. That's all that preload does, is compress the spring a bit, effectively adding a bit more stiffness as the spring is partially compressed, and usually a bit more ride height for a given load, unless the shock is at full travel already.

 

If I've got that wrong, Steve T or Embee will be along shortly to correct me.

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Tex
10 minutes ago, slowboy said:

That's it. That's all that preload does, is compress the spring a bit, effectively adding a bit more stiffness as the spring is partially compressed, and usually a bit more ride height for a given load, unless the shock is at full travel already.

 

If I've got that wrong, Steve T or Embee will be along shortly to correct me.

 

Thank you Brian. So, if increasing the preload effectively adds stiffness, decreasing it will remove some. Welcome to the dark side.. :D 

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djsb

The stiffness of the spring is NOT altered by the spring preload. All the spring preload does is compensate for the STATIC weight of the bike. So, if the free length of the spring is compressed by say 9mm due to the weight of the bike then 9mm of preload can be put onto the spring to maintain the same height. That's how I understand it anyway. Could be wrong though.

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Tex

Rather than ruining Ashley’s thread with a long, drawn out ‘oh yes it does’ & ‘oh no it doesn’t’ argument how about we just say to her “Try reducing the preload on the rear spring and see if that helps”? 

 

And we can start a new thread (if anyone insists) :) 

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Ashley

Thanks for all your replies guys. It's been interesting,  I'll have ago at reducing my preload and will let you know how it goes once we get back out on the roads again.  :brr:

 

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