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larryblag

Enfield KX concept V twin

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Hickky

Well, if this is what is coming out of the new design headquarters, great! Can it go into production? Yes but with normal forks. The problem will be making the engine. I presume it is essentially two RE single barrels and top end mated to a single crankshaft, but a lot of new tooling required and even stricter emission requirements by the time they could launch. However is there demand? Victory couldn't sell enough to keep the brand going. The Japanese don't seem to be contesting the segment very much and HD are going to manufacture in the far east to keep costs down so have some wriggle room to fight a new entrant. The fact that RE had a v twin pre war doesn't mean anything in the heritage market, I doubt if any current rider can remember the model, it's that long ago.

Maybe the first thing RE should do is to make a reliable, keenly priced twin that is selling well, research the market for heritage bobber v twins and finding out how much a significantly lower price will have on sales. Remember price doesn't seem to matter much when buying a crash helmet, so is brand very important in this segment? I rather suspect it is!

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slowboy

Nice concept bike. It looks like RE are discovering their mojo, and that's a good thing. Waiting for the dealers to get the new Interceptor in on demo. They seem to be bringing some real style and competition (and competitive pricing) to the market.

Edited by slowboy
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Trev
8 minutes ago, slowboy said:

Nice concept bike. It looks like RE are discovering their mojo, and that's a good thing. Waiting for the dealers to get the new Interceptor in on demo. They seem to be bringing some real style and competition (and competitive pricing) to the market.

 

Apparently all (most?) dealers will have Interceptor demos available early in the new year and customers will initially be asked to order from these ready for when stock is available which is not likely to be until the Spring - according to my localish daler Moto Corsa, They are expecting prices to be £5500 for the Interceptor (although some colour combos may add a premium), a few hundred more for the GT which sounds like a bit of a bargain up against the, admittedly more complex, Triumph offering and a 3 year warranty in the bike market is believed to be a first, anyone?

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larryblag

Before the CB1100 I priced up a T120. After adding two tone Silver/Cranberry paint, king & queen seat and sissy bar they wanted over £12k :no:

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Trev
43 minutes ago, larryblag said:

Before the CB1100 I priced up a T120. After adding two tone Silver/Cranberry paint, king & queen seat and sissy bar they wanted over £12k :no:

 

I think the T120 is a different proposition to the RE Interceptor and not just in price, it's going to be way more gutsy and better equipped (if you value traction wotsit and more digital gadgets) and, again to those that value it, a 'better' image, RE is still seen as a cheap alternative, dear I say it the Skoda of the bike world?

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baben

I had several Skodas and they were all brilliant - except the last one which had the VW 1.6 Tdi engine which was horrible.

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SteveThackery
15 hours ago, Hickky said:

Well, if this is what is coming out of the new design headquarters, great! Can it go into production? Yes but with normal forks

 

No, no, noooooh!!  Telescopic forks are an engineering abomination.  An exceptionally well developed bad idea.  Take a look at Brough Superior to see how a front end should be designed.

 

http://www.broughsuperiormotorcycles.com/engineering.html

 

In fact there are plenty of alternative front ends out there - the main reason we don't see them is because your average motorcycle customer is SUPER-conservative and is only happy if his/her bike looks like the one Rossi rides.

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SteveThackery
15 hours ago, Hickky said:

The problem will be making the engine. I presume it is essentially two RE single barrels and top end mated to a single crankshaft, but a lot of new tooling required and even stricter emission requirements by the time they could launch.

 

Why will that be a problem?  They'll only face the same challenges any other maker would experience.  Also, their existing engines will need to be kept up to date with emission requirements, so it's pretty much business as usual for them and every other manufacturer.   A lot of engine development is shared with, or offloaded to, expert consultant firms such as Ricardo (who've had a hand in the new Norton V4).  RE's Bullet engines were designed by AVL, and have been evolved into their unit construction versions since then.

 

Incidentally, there are two types of singles from RE now: the Bullet family and the Himalayan.  I wouldn't have thought they'd carry the Bullet barrels forward into a new engine.

 

 

Edited by SteveThackery
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larryblag

VThey may already be a long way towards it too. Will 800cc be enough? 

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Hickky

Steve, I admit that in one way the double wishbone front fork is a better engineering solution, adopted by most sports cars (Morgan excepted) but has a number of pitfalls as well. It is over complex, with four bearings which have to maintain much more precision over a longer period than car bearings. A load more precision made parts, stamped steel is not really acceptable, alongside a track rod end type ball joint. Crucially, it has a much higher unsprung weight than telescopics, particularly upside down types, therefore needing far superior shock absorbers and possibly stiffer springing. However many popular road cars use telescopic strut front suspension which really are a telescopic fork set up, using extra support at the bottom to allow two wheels to turn. You could also use the Yamaha Niken set up, but how weird is that?  To think RE, going for the budget end of the market could use this fork type is cloud cuckoo land. It is all very well looking at one of the dearest retro 'cycles as an example of solid engineering, but BS are only using it to ape the 1930s. Would George Brough ditched the double wishbone if telescopics were available and made well enough at the time he was  building his machines? 

Lastly, getting new heads, developed by an outside consultancy, or even getting them built on contract, increases cost to RE. You can see from the high power twins and singles out there, just how much engineering goes into high output four stroke engines. Abnormally short stroke with very complex pistons, combined with titanium valves and expensive springs can increase power, but a v twin for a cruiser bike needs a longer stroke and torque, what can outside consultants bring to the party? Their other machines use torque in preference to power, therefore their most efficient heads, watercooled cylinders, running on a single throw crank seems the most logical solution.

Will they turn it into production? I doubt it!

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SteveThackery
2 hours ago, Hickky said:

Will they turn it into production? I doubt it!

 

I agree!  Shame, though - it could be interesting.

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