Bike is cutting out... why?

[Davrich1984 4]

So here I am, stuck on the side of the A16 waiting for the RAC, so I thought I’d ask a question. I was driving along fine then all of a sudden the bike cut out. No indication as to why, just stopped. The battery died a few weeks back as I hadn’t used it in so long, so I put it on a trickle charge. It started fine and was running fine, then 35 miles from home it just stopped. Now before you ask, yes it has fuel. After it cut out, I leave it 5 mins and then it starts no problem. It cuts out again after 20 odd seconds. I will try and put a video to show. So I’m thinking maybe it’s the battery, but I also have a Datatool alarm/ immobiliser on it, so don’t know if that’s messing up, although it is running???

 

any help whilst I sit here waiting would help

 

 

[embee 7,288]

I was wondering what on earth it could be ……………………. and then you mention the Datatool ………………………………..

 

Good luck with the recovery etc. I'd start with looking to junk the Datatool, nothing but trouble.

 

I have had a couple of issues with tarnished connectors and a failed relay (it was the fan relay but it is identical to the fuel pump relay so …..), and any such things could potentially cause a stop, but the Datatool is candidate #1 in my book.

Edited April 7, 2019 by embee

[Davrich1984 4]

Well, I’m back home now. The guy said it’s probably the Datatool too. He suggested that it could be the Datatool fob battery dying, which is messing with the signals? Does this sound plausible? I am worried about taking it out now considering it’s totally random when it cuts out

[Andy m 23,426]

Glad you got home.

 

Definately possible it's Datafool. These things are the single biggest reason the AA and RAC get called out. It's not like it's protecting anything either, wailing alarms only make people turn their music up and Honda already chipped your key and left micro dots on various components. 

 

If you decide to get rid, watch the YouTube videos though. Their hobby club box of tricks is hacked into vital bits of loom, so you'll need either solder and heat shrink or proper automotive crimp on connectors. 

 

Andy

[Davrich1984 4]

I have never had a problem before this.  It just seems slightly strange that it could be the key fob, as opposed to the actual alarm itself. 

 

I am a little reluctant to get rid of an alarm system completely.  If i was to remove the Datatool, is there anything you suggest to replace it.  I appreciate that i have the Honda HISS thing, and i have the bike data tagged.  

[Davrich1984 4]

Here is some video of me attempting to restart the bike earlier this afternoon.  This time it cut out after 20 seconds.  Typically when recovery turned up, it ran for 20 minutes before cutting out on the drive home (recovery following behind)

 

 

[sad vampire 109]

The symptoms you describe are definitely lack of spark, both sparks, so very likely the Datatool blocking the LT to the coil.

 

[Andy m 23,426]

If the key fob is transmitting when it shouldn't or some over complex under-tested bit of Maplins left overs is failing to see it, it will ruin your day. 

 

Is the light sequence when it dies on the video the same as hitting the kill switch? Datafool tend to mimic this, as Sad Vampire says by killing the spark. 

 

I will never have anything electronic that the vehicle OEM didn't develop and fit. They are simply unreliable and have ruined peoples days more often than having Diesel and petrol on the same pump.

 

If security worries you, get a disc lock that costs at least a hundred quid and have the house alarm extended into the garage if possible. You and maybe your neighbours are the only ones who will ever respond to an alarm with anything except mild annoyance. Even plod assumes it's just another electronic failure in progress. HISS already includes a better means of preventing scrotes screwdrivering the ignition lock. 

 

Andy

[embee 7,288]

You might well be able to just disable the immobiliser part of it. As the others say, if it replicates the kill switch function it cuts the fuel relay signal. As you say the Honda HISS is a reliable immobiliser, if you want an alarm the Datatool may well work fine as long as you disable the bits which can immobilise the bike.

 

I have a cheap and cheerful motion only alarm fitted with a hidden isolator switch so I can power the thing down totally when not needed (it has a small current drain even when not switched on). I use it when camping, just to let me know if anyone decides to try to move the bike a night. It cost all of about £15 from the auction site and so far it has worked perfectly, when I have set it and before subsequently turning it off I often give the bike a good rock to see if it will go off, and so far it has. There are 3 different sensitivity settings operated by the remote controls which seem to be usefully different, ranging from a bit touchy through to wheeling the bike away.

[Davrich1984 4]

Thanks for your help guys.  Its just strange why its suddenly decided to start playing up now!!!  I didn't buy the Datatool, it came already installed when i bought the bike.  Just disconcerting when I need to use the bike to drive an hour to work tomorrow.  Its not filling me with confidence!!!

[pjm 6,041]

Have you got a back up remote? Might be worth trying that to see if it solves the problem.

[pjm 6,041]

Just googled Datatool and there is an online manual if you don’t have one. Shows how to change the remote battery.

[ChrisCB 6,651]

Here is a short datafool instructional video.

 

 

[Rocker66 34,351]

2 hours ago, Andy m said:

Glad you got home.

 

Definately possible it's Datafool. These things are the single biggest reason the AA and RAC get called out. It's not like it's protecting anything either, wailing alarms only make people turn their music up.

 

 

Andy

I agree that’s often true but not always. Years ago I had a Kawasaki GT550 fitted with Krauser panniers and Sue had a Kawasaki GPz 550. To which the panniers could also be attached.We had arranged to meet in town where I arrived first and parked near the OAP drop in centre. When Sue arrived she parked next to me and as she had keys to the panniers went to put her gloves in them which set off my alarm which she hadn’t thought about. She was immediately confronted by an elderly gentleman waving his stick and telling her to leave that bike alone.

 

Edited April 7, 2019 by Rocker66

[Mike5100 2,061]

1 hour ago, Rocker66 said:

I agree that’s often true but not always. Years ago I had a Kawasaki GT550 fitted with Krauser panniers and Sue had a Kawasaki GPz 550. To which the panniers could also be attached.We had arranged to meet in town where I arrived first and parked near the OAP drop in centre. When Sue arrived she parked next to me and as she had keys to the panniers went to put her gloves in them which set off my alarm which she hadn’t thought about. She was immediately confronted by an elderly gentleman waving his stick and telling her to leave that bike alone.

 

 

 

........ is that because you didn't realise it was your wife Rocker? 

[Trumpet 215]

Cat one alarms have to isolate two systems, usually the fuel injectors and the kill switch circuit.  Nothing to do with the remote fob, but there are two relays in the Alarm, and they can play up . Alarms also have a backup battery in them, that dies from five years old onwards causing all sorts of issues. The best place for it is in the Bin. The Last Datatool I saw was tied to the fence by its wires at Zebrugge ferry port where you wait for the ship 

[listener 11,144]

My previous 750X had a Honda Averto alarm fitted - nice neat plug-in job, I think.

 

A couple of years ago it started causing problems. Luckily it was more an issue getting it to turn on rather than off.

The problem was traced to a fuse. It wasn't blown but it certainly wasn't working right - replacing it fixed the problem.

 

Due to that, I decided not to fit an alarm to my current beast.

 

 

Back in the late 90s, I took part in a club weekend trip to Lochcarron (during which we took the Glenelg ferry over to Skye and returned via the still-tolled bridge).

On the morning of our departure back to the rat-race, one of the guys couldn't turn his alarm off. The problem was traced to the IR sensor (it looks like an LED, and receives a coded signal from the remote) fitted to the side panel of his bike.

Because it hadn't been properly protected, the legs of the sensor had corroded through. The alarm was essentially deaf to his requests for it to shut up!

 

The local garage helped him disembowel the bugger and he later caught up with us. Apparently neither he nor the mechanics could understand how the alarm, sat unplugged and unloved in the middle of the workshop, could still be emitting sound. He was amazed to hear that it might have an internal back-up battery.

 

You'd think a serving police officer would have been a bit more savvy?! 

Edited April 9, 2019 by listener

[Trev 18,532]

I've had two Datatool alarms go wrong, both pre-fitted to GSXR's and in both instances I removed and binned the damn things, one using 'hammer mode' funnily enough 

[Jeffprince 4,921]

My dealer, Thunder Road, removes alarms from all part-ex's as a matter of course. They say they cause more problems than the positives of selling with them included. 

[kayz1 2,928]

It was so bad with some factory fitted alarms of the same make fitted by Triumph they ( the factory ) produced a kit to un-fit it is that a real term then...but i think you get the picture.

I had a mate who brought one to me and his bike to fit for him...

Lyn.

[Davrich1984 4]

Thanks for all your input guys... thought i would just give you an update.  So, i bought new batteries and replaced them in the fobs.  After advice from the Datatool representative saying, "The battery in the remote fob could be the issue".  Full of confidence i donned my helmet and took the bike out again.  Low and behold, one mile down the road it cuts out again.  This time i payed a little more attention, when it does cut out, after i turn the key off you can hear a relay going absolutely mental.  As well as that the little LED for the alarm is almost strobing, flashing on and off that fast.  So, i ended up swallowing my pride and pushing my bike back home.  Now i have a problem, my closest Datatool stockist, to check the unit over (again, at the advice of the data tool staff member) is in Grimsby, half an hours ride away.  I am not pushing the bike that far!!!!  Annoyed is not the word!!!!!

 

Like i say though, thanks for all your advice!

[Andy m 23,426]

If a relay is clicking its getting either variable feed or earth or is ****ed. So

 

1. Replace the relay. If this makes no difference:

2. Pull the wires off 85 and 86 connect them to any old relay to make the Datafool think its still ruining your life. Place a jumper wire or leave open in the relays old socket pins  87 and 30 to get the engine to run as Honda intended . 

 

In this state you can get to Grimsby and shove their pile of Maplins leftovers where the sun shineth not. 

 

Andy

[Davrich1984 4]

Well, another update for you once again.   I came across this...

 

https://www.datatool.co.uk/safetyrecalls4/

 

Apparently, the alarm I have is under a safety recall, due to the fact the alarm "may suffer operational issues which ultimately lead to the motorcycle becoming immobilised".  I put in my serial number, and guess what... its one of the affected units!!!

[listener 11,144]

11 hours ago, Davrich1984 said:

Apparently, the alarm I have is under a safety recall, [...] its one of the affected units!!!

 

You'd better get pushing then. You should make Grimsby before summer! 

[embee 7,288]

12 hours ago, Davrich1984 said:

………………...  I put in my serial number, and guess what... its one of the affected units!!!

You'll probably find all the serial numbers are listed...……………….. or certainly should be.