Bart Stilgo 428 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Well my 2016XDCT is now on 9000 miles on its original DID chain. The only treatment it gets is scot oil applied with a tooth brush and occasionally sprayed with wd40 to wash off the dirt then a dry off then scot oil applied with a toothbrush At the moment I have not adjusted the chain as it doesn't need it Now, does the DCT have anything to do with reducing chain wear? Cheers Link to post
Tex 36,817 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 44 minutes ago, Bart Stilgo said: Now, does the DCT have anything to do with reducing chain wear? Quite possibly. The shifts are so smooth it, very likely, reduces snatching on the chain. Somewhere on YouTube is a video of a DCT bike on a rolling road and it’s impossible to tell when the shift points are by looking at the chain. Went a long way towards selling me the Integra that did. 3 Link to post
Tex 36,817 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 hour ago, SteveThackery said: That's the fundamental problem. Most people know f**k all about tribology, but are happy to give advice with the authority of a career expert. It's the same with almost all other disciplines. For example, did you notice how the day after Grenfell we suddenly had 60 million fire safety experts in the UK? Reminds me of a (lifelong) Vincent enthusiast I used to know. He was telling me of the pitfalls of buying one (they had been out of production for 20 years at that time) and it went something like “They’ve all been taken apart at least once now. And always by some tw@t who works behind the bacon counter at Sainsbury’s or as a pox doctor’s clerk and is convinced they know better than the factory”. 5 Link to post
Spindizzy 7,109 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Tex said: Reminds me of a (lifelong) Vincent enthusiast I used to know. He was telling me of the pitfalls of buying one (they had been out of production for 20 years at that time) and it went something like “They’ve all been taken apart at least once now. And always by some tw@t who works behind the bacon counter at Sainsbury’s or as a pox doctor’s clerk and is convinced they know better than the factory”. A lot of people like to think they are doing something right and positive to support their bikes maintenance. But I am happy to admit that chain spray (tacky type) is worse than doing nothing imho. Dribble of oil now and again does no harm and probably does some good. I don't mind a little rust on my chain, its not pitted or weakened and wont ever fail because of some surface stuff. Will wear out before its an issue. Link to post
Hickky 3,131 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 I happened across that fort 9 video two nights ago and nearly posted about it. So from now on, cleaner, WD39 +1. Lubricant, smidge of gear oil. Or buy the plastic maggot! 1 Link to post
XXX 2,697 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 “As useful as a ventilated condom”. 🤣🤣🤣 Link to post
listener 11,180 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 4 hours ago, Woody 99 said: “As useful as a ventilated condom”. 🤣🤣🤣 Indeed - OOPS! 1 Link to post
SteveThackery 3,090 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 I think this video has convinced me that the only thing that actually gets lubricated are the rollers (potentially). Certainly I don't think anything will get past the 'O'- or 'X'-ring seals. If it did, they wouldn't be doing their job. But lubing the rollers - yes, that makes sense. From now on I'm going to brush gear oil on them and dump the aerosols. I think I'll do that even on the Enfield, which doesn't have an 'O'-ring chain. PS: I think he was actually slightly wrong to suggest that 75-90 gear oil is very thick - gear oils use a different grading scale (i.e. they don't carry on from the usual 10 to 50 range of engine oils). I think an EP80 gear oil is about the same as a straight 30 motor oil (can anyone confirm?). 1 Link to post
RoyG 233 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 I started using the tacky chain spray about six months ago. I noticed a couple of the links were not lying flat and were very tight. I ordered a new chain and thought I would leave the bike until it arrived in case it damaged the sprockets. When I took the chain off four days later it was that tight I could hold a good portion of it horizontally. I don't know if it was the spray or just the end of the chains life, but I'm sticking to oil in future. Link to post
KingJames 1,262 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 My DCT is much smoother accelerating since I fitted the Tutoro (which gives a very consistent lubing). No tight links after two years, no adjustment needed since fitting. Completely hear about the x rings etc, but the metal on metal having some oil plus the keeping it clean makes it worthwhile IMO. A lady biker on the A23 into town on Tuesday had an extremely dry and rusty chain, could hear it a mile away. It didn't sound happy and I hope she gives it some TLC before it breaks apart on her. Maybe different horses for courses as I'm a London commuter come all weathers and stop start traffic so frequent acceleration strain. Link to post
wendeg 95 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 8 hours ago, SteveThackery said: I think this video has convinced me that the only thing that actually gets lubricated are the rollers (potentially). Certainly I don't think anything will get past the 'O'- or 'X'-ring seals. If it did, they wouldn't be doing their job. But lubing the rollers - yes, that makes sense. From now on I'm going to brush gear oil on them and dump the aerosols. I think I'll do that even on the Enfield, which doesn't have an 'O'-ring chain. PS: I think he was actually slightly wrong to suggest that 75-90 gear oil is very thick - gear oils use a different grading scale (i.e. they don't carry on from the usual 10 to 50 range of engine oils). I think an EP80 gear oil is about the same as a straight 30 motor oil (can anyone confirm?). I use gear oil 75-90 (left over from transmission oil change of my pickup) and i don't think it s any thicker than engine oil. It s been ten years since i stopped spraying lube and using oil and i will not go back... The chain on my transalp (oil & paintbrush) gave me about 40k miles without any need to even make an adjustement. Have to admit though that climatic conditions in Malta are very different to those in uk. Link to post
Andywills77 433 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 (edited) 50 minutes ago, wendeg said: I use gear oil 75-90 (left over from transmission oil change of my pickup) and i don't think it s any thicker than engine oil. It s been ten years since i stopped spraying lube and using oil and i will not go back... The chain on my transalp (oil & paintbrush) gave me about 40k miles without any need to even make an adjustement. Have to admit though that climatic conditions in Malta are very different to those in uk. Malta...great place. My uncle (and God father) comes from Malta. Fond memories of seeing the church in Valletta with the bomb. I was 15 at the time. Loved the blue lagoon. I remember Popeye's village. Somebody had knicked the boat. We went a comedy night at a vinyard. Remember the comedian saying the Romans built the roads and they'd never been touched since. Also remember the green buses, especially the one with the one armed driver. Think I was told that they got passed down, from father to son sort of thing Wonderful place, well worth a visit...was the first time I visited another country Edited April 26, 2019 by Andywills77 2 Link to post
Bart Stilgo 428 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 We have some EP680 gear oil at work. Its like treacle (seriously) and used in worm and wheel reduction gearboxes, and its food grade Comes from Canada Could be worth a try. 1 Link to post
wendeg 95 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Andywills77 said: Malta...great place. My uncle (and God father) comes from Malta. Fond memories of seeing the church in Valletta with the bomb. I was 15 at the time. Loved the blue lagoon. I remember Popeye's village. Somebody had knicked the boat. We went a comedy night at a vinyard. Remember the comedian saying the Romans built the roads and they'd never been touched since. Also remember the green buses, especially the one with the one armed driver. Think I was told that they got passed down, from father to son sort of thing Think you are referring to the Mosta church. My late grandfather used to be a bus driver even before they were green. Used to be painted according to the village or town they were assigned to service. Then my uncle continued with the business. Link to post
SteveThackery 3,090 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) So, this thread seems to offer two legitimate conclusions. Firstly, all you need is oil on the chain, and it's best not to apply that from an aerosol. Secondly, the case for automatic chain oilers still seems pretty strong (although getting just the right amount of oil delivered can be a challenge with some of them). Otherwise, brushing it on seems a good alternative. Having seen the video, do you still think chain oilers are a good thing? Edited April 27, 2019 by SteveThackery Link to post
Slowboy 20,425 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 5 minutes ago, SteveThackery said: So, this thread seems to offer two legitimate conclusions. Firstly, all you need is oil on the chain, and it's best not to apply that from an aerosol. Secondly, the case for automatic chain oilers still seems pretty strong (although getting just the right amount of oil delivered can be a challenge with some of them). Otherwise, brushing it on seems a good alternative. Do you agree about chain oilers in general? Yes, completely. When my last bottle of blue scottoiler runs out, I'll be switching to EP80 gear oil. And I'll be switching to that only because that's what goes in the bevel drive of the Kawasaki. for reference I use a Tutorro chain oiler because it's simple and easy to use. I've used Scottoiler in the past and they've been just as easy to use, but my current bike has no vavuum connector, as it's a single cylinder engine and the only thing that needs regular balancing is the nut behind the bars😁 Link to post
roddy 845 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 The EP80 gear oil, does it encourage grit,grime and salt to stick to the chain? Link to post
roddy 845 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 A good video to look at is 'fortnine' he has done quite a in depth investigation into chain lubing. Link to post
skorpion 945 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 My take on the subject is oil stops rust, keeps the seal's supple, and lubricates the sprockets to slow down wear. Link to post
Chriswright03 1,257 Posted April 27, 2019 Author Share Posted April 27, 2019 1 hour ago, roddy said: A good video to look at is 'fortnine' he has done quite a in depth investigation into chain lubing. This video in the link is from Fortnine. Link to post
Chriswright03 1,257 Posted April 27, 2019 Author Share Posted April 27, 2019 1 hour ago, skorpion said: My take on the subject is oil stops rust, keeps the seal's supple, and lubricates the sprockets to slow down wear. That aligns with my view in the past but after looking at the video and reading what other people have said in this thread I am thinking that half of the problems with chains is they are oiled too often and the gunge that sticks to them does more damage to the chain and sprockets. Link to post
Spindizzy 7,109 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 2 hours ago, Chriswright03 said: That aligns with my view in the past but after looking at the video and reading what other people have said in this thread I am thinking that half of the problems with chains is they are oiled too often and the gunge that sticks to them does more damage to the chain and sprockets. For chain spray yes I would agree, but not oil. Oil tends to fling a bit but it takes the crud with it. 2 Link to post
SteveThackery 3,090 Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 15 hours ago, Spindizzy said: For chain spray yes I would agree, but not oil. Oil tends to fling a bit but it takes the crud with it. I agree with that, although it's only a subjective impression. But with the Tutoro on my NC the chain definitely appeared to remain cleaner. Link to post
larryblag 14,236 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 On 25/04/2019 at 14:45, alhendo1 said: Come to think of it I think I might have some scottoil hiding in the garage somewhere... Might try and dig that out.... Me too! Thanks for that. Mine is darkholed somewhere in the shed. 1 Link to post
Chriswright03 1,257 Posted April 30, 2019 Author Share Posted April 30, 2019 Having linked the video to the Guy who will be servicing my NC he reckons the tests are not done in real conditions and gear oil with be likely to throw off onto the back tyre. I reckon if it does you are using too much but I asked him for his opinion. He did say that here the heat can make the chain stretch of not lubricated sufficiently and as he is servicing it next week I guess it will be. Link to post
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