starting to annoy

[DaveStewart 267]

I have owned a Nc 700 integra for just three years now,it had only 700 miles when I bought it,I had to change the battery pretty much straight away,then after a few months,the new battery packed in,still under warranty so took it back for another new one.So now on the third battery,and yesterday,KAPUT, nothing,completely packed up out side a supermarket!I turned the ignition on,couple of lights flickered once or twice then zilch.I got the wife to nip down and long story short, jump leads done the trick.So, my question is this,is, or was there some sort of fault with this bike,did it have a recall regarding the battery?It is gonna have to go as I am sick of the amount of times i have had to give it a jump start. TIA folks.

[embattle 332]

https://www.honda.co.uk/motorcycles/my-bike/maintenance/recalls-and-updates.html

[embee 7,288]

There obviously is something wrong with the bike, what you describe is not advertised as a feature of the model.

It sounds to me like a fairly simple issue, quite possibly to do with the main 30A fuse/starter relay connections. There was a recall on 750 bikes around 2015 I think for a potential fault with the starter relay, it's not impossible for them to become faulty, basically all the electrical power goes through it. Check the fuse in it is clean and bright on the spades, preferably fit a new one as a matter of course.

Once running it's a simple check to make sure the charging system is working more or less correctly, more subtle issues need further investigations but easy to check it's basically OK or not. If you're seeing around 14 to 14.5V at the battery terminals when revved a bit then there's not much wrong, much lower or higher then there's a problem.

 

I've read of only one or 2 examples of problems with the reg/rec on the NC, they use the generally very reliable MOSFET type unit. That's not to say it can't fail, but it's rare.

 

 

[Argyll 1,334]

Easy to do a basic check on the charging system. Simply put a meter across the battery with the engine running and make sure that you're getting between 13.7v and 14.5v (depending on revs).

[riders in the storm 475]

As alluded to above, you need to check there isn't a significant current drain as well when the bike is switched off. Use a multimeter on ammeter setting from the positive terminal to the lead.....

[DaveM59 1,603]

Bet the regulator is overcharging. Sometimes the ECU lamp will light as it doesn't like too many volts but not always as there is enough other drains like headlights to buffer the ECU from damage. Any repeated battery failure can only be due to either parasitic drain or overcharging.

The Integra relay is next to the battery and just wedges into a rubber housing IIRC.

[trisaki 2,029]

How many short trips do you do  , alarmed  ? , keep it plugged into a smart charger when not in use if you can , what make of batteries have you been using  , their are some  rubbish ones on that auction site,  copies etc 

[DaveStewart 267]

Hi again.to be fair,I do loads of short trips,work is only 10 min ride away,the make is "unibat". I have nothing that can cause parasitic drain.I shall have  look at the relay mentioned by Dave M59 cheers all for the tips.But I have to say, I have zero tech abilities,although I shall borrow a meter from work

[Mr Toad 9,022]

With lots of short trips like that it could be the cumulative effect of the ride not being long enough to replace the charge used to start the bike.

 

I have to admit that I have no idea how long the trip needs to be to replace what was taken out of the battery to start the engine though.

[embee 7,288]

15 hours ago, DaveStewart said:

Hi again.to be fair,I do loads of short trips,work is only 10 min ride away,the make is "unibat". I have nothing that can cause parasitic drain.I shall have  look at the relay mentioned by Dave M59 cheers all for the tips.But I have to say, I have zero tech abilities,although I shall borrow a meter from work

2 things.

First yes, check the charging voltage, if that's OK then nothing serious is going on.

2nd, just had a look at the Unibat site and they do various ranges of battery (like most manufacturers) and I suspect you may have one of the "lower" spec versions. The NC specifies the Yuasa YTZ14S as original equipment. The YTZ range is a premium spec with high cranking current (CA) capability. Other makes do similar specs, the Unibat version looks like it should be a CTZ14S  http://www.unibatitalia.com/en/batterie/377/ctz14s-fa if you have one of the other variants like http://www.unibatitalia.com/en/batterie/86/12n14-3a-sm

 it might have a much lower current delivery so won't have as much reserve for starting when partially discharged.

In your circumstances it's possible a lithium battery would work more successfully, I have one on my Integra (Shido https://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_prod/248963 ). They can deliver very high starting current, but more significantly they will re-charge much more quickly than a lead-acid battery following a start.

[SteveThackery 3,090]

2 hours ago, embee said:

In your circumstances it's possible a lithium battery would work more successfully, I have one on my Integra (Shido https://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_prod/248963 ). They can deliver very high starting current, but more significantly they will re-charge much more quickly than a lead-acid battery following a start.

 

FWIW I've had one on my Enfield for some time now and it has worked perfectly.  Cost twice as much, though.

[DaveStewart 267]

OK folks,got a meter.The battery had been on charge all night,so when i took the bike outside it was showing 12.7 v  I then fired it up, put the meter on and it was up at 14.4v   So I am thinking it is charging ok?

[trisaki 2,029]

What does it read with ignition on but not running  

[Grumpy old man 4,670]

Reading this thread with interest, Thanks. Hope you get it sorted Dave

[DaveStewart 267]

19 minutes ago, trisaki said:

What does it read with ignition on but not running  

12.9 before then turned ignition on and went down to 12.3

[DaveStewart 267]

11 minutes ago, Grumpy old man said:

Reading this thread with interest, Thanks. Hope you get it sorted Dave

So do I pal

 

[shiggsy 529]

Seems ok from those figures.  Lots of short trips may be the cause, you may want to check and record the voltage once a week see if its dropping over time.  If it is not and it then suddenly fails to start, it's some other problem.  (This is why I always have a voltage readout displayed on my bike).

[DaveStewart 267]

4 minutes ago, shiggsy said:

Seems ok from those figures.  Lots of short trips may be the cause, you may want to check and record the voltage once a week see if its dropping over time.  If it is not and it then suddenly fails to start, it's some other problem.  (This is why I always have a voltage readout displayed on my bike).

To be honest,I had not put the optimiser on for a few weeks and yeh, I do loads of short (3/4 )miles at a time. Shall have to be more careful 

[Argyll 1,334]

1 hour ago, shiggsy said:

Seems ok from those figures

I'd agree.

[DaveStewart 267]

Thanx all for the help as usual. Much appreciated. 

[neojynx 722]

15 hours ago, DaveStewart said:

To be honest,I had not put the optimiser on for a few weeks and yeh, I do loads of short (3/4 )miles at a time. Shall have to be more careful 

I run my bike every weekday and do 164 miles.  I still put the optimiser on every night even so.  It's just a habit I have got used to and never had a battery issue of course.

[DaveStewart 267]

8 hours ago, neojynx said:

I run my bike every weekday and do 164 miles.  I still put the optimiser on every night even so.  It's just a habit I have got used to and never had a battery issue of course.

learnt my lesson this time,hopefully, 

[jeremyr62 2,538]

Besides the battery all those short trips wont be very good for the engine. The oil will start to look like custard from condensation. If you can, a  long run when the oil gets good and hot for a long period to evaporate the water will do it good. Give it a thorough thrashing in other words.

Edited August 23, 2019 by jeremyr62

[DaveStewart 267]

8 hours ago, jeremyr62 said:

Besides the battery all those short trips wont be very good for the engine. The oil will start to look like custard from condensation. If you can, a  long run when the oil gets good and hot for a long period to evaporate the water will do it good. Give it a thorough thrashing in other words.

Ha, a thrashing once a week shall be administered. A trip to Blackpool and back should do the trick.

[DCTPaul 629]

My 2p...

Skim reading the above...

Quality Battery YUASA etc is a must...

Possible Reg Rec issue,

12ish at rest... 13ish running just over tickover... may well be charging the battery, but may be Overcharging...

So need to connect a volt meeter and take it for a run and see how high the volts go...

Gilly Runners went... 15+volts when at 40mph...

Boiled the battery...