To DCT or not that is the question.

[colin1450 22]

Just thinking of changing bike.  I currently have a Suzuki DL 650 V-strom.with low seat and lowered suspension.  which my wife and I tour Europe on every summer.  I ride with pillion 90% of the time.  I'm thinking of changing to a Honda NC 750S.DCT. I'm too short in the leg for a 750X.  and I have bad Arthritis in left hand.

question 1.  how reliable is the complicated DCT system.

question 2.  How comfortable is the seat.

question 3. what range would you get from the fuel tank.

question 4. are the cables & wiring long enough to put slightly higher bars like the X models.

 

 

 

[Rocker66 34,375]

1) with regard to DCT I would suggest that if possible you get a test ride to see how it suits you. Personally I don’t like it but some others love it a matter of personal taste. It could be the answer to your arthritis problem. I think that with the odd exception it has been proved to be reliable. 

2) Many people have changed or modified  their seat whilst others find it fine.

3&4) I will leave to those with better info on the subject.

[listener 11,158]

I've got a 750X so I can only answer some questions.

 

Q1 I had my previous 750X DCT for 4yrs and had no trouble with the DCT in that time

(other than the odd hiccup if I started the motor too quickly, before the electronics had done their thang).

 

Q2 I have had little problem with the seat on the current bike, and was only marginally annoyed at the sloped seat on the previous 750X (and manual 700X before that).

I regularly ride 400-500 miles a day on trips around Scotland, and by the time my 'arris is complaining (around 200 miles) I need to stop for fuel anyway.

I obviously have a better padded backside that many of the others on here!

 

Q3 Depends on your riding style and where you ride.

I get around 220 miles on a tankful when hooning down the A90/motorways at 70mph (honest hosiffer!).

I get nearer 260 miles when wiggling along the twisties.

Some of the folks on here are either stick insects, or have very limp wrists , and claim close to 300 miles a tank. 

[listener 11,158]

17 minutes ago, Rocker66 said:

1) with regard to DCT I would suggest that if possible you get a test ride to see how it suits you.

 

Rocker's spot on with this.

 

I first had a shot of a 700X DCT when my manual was in for a service.

I wasn't sure if it was safe to change modes 'on the go' and found the D-mode highly annoying going up one of the hillier roads in Aberdeen, on the way to work.

I tried S-mode on the way home and that was better.

 

A year or so later I had a proper test ride (75 miles over varying road types) of a 750X DCT and was hooked! 

Edited October 28, 2019 by listener

[poldark 1,509]

1) Plenty sold worldwide and no significant issues or concerns, very very occasionally a sensor has been reported failed & replaced, but for me it's more reliable than standard manual clutch arrangement.

 

2) Varied reports but primary issue I believe is the slight downward slope, several people (me included) simply insert some washers under the front seat mount to make it level. I also splashed out on a £13 bead seat on Amazon (think Turkish cab driver!).

 

3) 200+ miles, very dependent on roads/speed/personal style. I don't think it likes high-speed (70+) cruising. I don't commute and tend to "bimble" (50-60mph max) and 10k miles average is 78mpg.

 

4) I have risers with rise & pullback, no cable issues, but as you'd expect there is a max limit, can't recall my size (!!)

Edited October 28, 2019 by poldark
Typo

[Ciaran 6,880]

I have a S manual and come from an X DCT. Great choice either way!

 

Q1) as already mentioned, they've been phenomenally reliable for an advanced piece if kit. Very infrequent and minor faults, one fella in the states on here seemed to have a plague bike but it was one amongst thousands. I strongly recommend you try it. Largely the DCT is inoffensive and does its job extremely well but I never felt fully in control.

2) again subjective but honestly, its rubbish. I strongly recommend you factor in the cost of a SHAD or a repadding of the original seat. The last long trip I did of about 350 round trip I genuinely struggled to walk afterwards. Partially because it's an unusual journey bit a lot because the seat is cripplingly terrible.

3) I've had up to 240 out of it though 200-220 more regularly. I average around the 85mpg mark, down to 80 for prolonged 70mph.

4) hard to say. I would say theres enough give in mine but can't guarantee it.

 

Please bear in mind you can get a lowering kit for the X that drops the height by ad much as 40mm. You'll need a shorter kickstand; the one from the S does the job!

[Exceledsteve 2,191]

Have you tried the Integra? DCT as standard, low seat height, higher bars, plenty of wind protection for touring and I think a comfy seat, although I never rode one for more than an hour. They're a bargain second hand/almost new.

[Andy m 23,473]

You need to go test ride one. I owned a Wee-Strom before my NC. The Strom is a top heavy lardy lump up to 20 mph but is then noticeably more powerful and revvy. The Diesel like NC and DCT (on which I have done less that 5 miles, mine was manual) is going to be a change for sure. The DCT may actually be the better route as if you ignore what it's doing it may hide how very different the engine is. Read MCN to see what happens when you fail to understand not all engines like 7000 rpm. 

 

I would agree with the answers to the four questions above. 

 

If you put the miles on you'll love how the valves and plugs on the NC are just behind the radiator. The back cylinder on the Strom proves Moto Guzzi have one good idea per century at least. 

 

Andy

 

 

[poldark 1,509]

My 2penneth is that if you decide the DCT isn't for you, then take a serious look at the Tracer 700 (or MT07/T7) and the CB500X.

[embee 7,288]

As above.

The DCT system has proven extremely reliable. Sure there have been one or two problems with odd bikes, but nothing serious. There were a few (literally) cases of broken pins in the selector mechanism but that disappeared after an early batch of bikes with a changed part number for the pin. Since then no issues. Genuinely nothing inherent to worry about.

You can use the DCT is a variety of modes, and you can use manual selection to override auto modes in various ways for example downshifts for overtakes, downshifts for engine braking, or use upshifts to go up the gears early in S modes if you feel it is revving more than you wish, or of course full manual mode where you take control (but it still downshifts when engine speed drops below a threshold, so no stalling etc). If you have left hand issues then it's made for you.

As for the Integra option, I wouldn't say the seat is low at all. Yes you get pretty decent weather protection, but underseat storage is less than the frunk on the other models, and the std seat isn't particularly comfy for extended miles, I've modded mine with a Shad which I've altered for shape.

Range depends a lot on how you ride, use of throttle and speed of cruising, but general use is typically 75mpg but easy to get 85mpg if you are touring on open roads. That's 200mile safe range, more depending on how far into "reserve" you want to go. Fuel consumption does tend to increase noticeably above around 70mph, cruising at 130kph on autoroutes I get about 68mpg typically, otherwise 85mpg is normal.

An S with some seat mods and screen would probably serve you well. Stock suspension is budget, maybe consider factoring in allowance for a replacement rear shock if you're doing nearly all 2-up riding, The YSS or Wilbers or Nitron shocks are commonly used, and can be built to your requirements (I have a Nitron), you may get on fine with the OE item.

Decent tyres make a big difference to how enjoyable it is to ride too. Michelin Road5 tyres suit it very well.

[Griff 1,556]

The key word here is Pillion. I personally would not impose the pillion perch of a NC on any pillion for any length of time other than a short commute. On the other hand the 650 Strom has a much better pillion perch and is well proven as a pillion carrier.  On the riders section of seat I have done 800+ kms in a day and coped reasonably well. 

 

The DCT system is well proven and trouble free. Personally I like it a lot and it took me very little time to get used to it on a test ride initially. I continue to use it on a X-Adv. 

 

I cannot answer the other two questions as I never changed bars and I have forgotten the range since I last had an NC. 

[poldark 1,509]

I'd missed the pillion requirement, which is another positive for the DCT as zero pressure on the rider for helmet slapping at gear-change time.

 

Yes I realise you're all Barry Sheene and can do it perfectly every time, or clutchless, but this alone was my initial reason for considering DCT and I'm not disappointed!

 

However all of this is very much dependant on your pillion being happy with the minimal perch, I added a pad to assist, but ultimately bought a Burgman 650 (at SWMBO's suggestion after longer rides on the NC), of course I've kept the NC too!!

[rjp996 1,091]

With regards DCT - I do a long commute daily and its great at that. My bike is a 2015 750x, and its in the high 70,000+ mile range now and the DCT has been faultless, as has the bike apart from normal wear items, the only failure ive had was a relay.

 

 

[thwartedEfforts 264]

@poldark touched on this.

 

If you truly take a pillion 90% of the time and you have arthritis in your left hand same as I do then DCT will prove to be a game changer. No more bonking heads. No more sore thumbs and fingers

 

If you don’t get on with it during a test drive, bloody well go back out again and try harder 

[Wedgepilot 727]

I've done 30,000 miles on my DCT X with zero issues of any kind. Honda reliability at its best. Range is about 220-230 for me, that's with lots of motorway miles and town filtering. The biggest problem with the seat is the forward slope, I've found leaning forward is a cheap solution! 

[makman 975]

NC700X DCT here. Love it for riding in London. Looking at changing it for something else when I no longer have to commute in London.  It is a consumate filtering bike and the DCT has been excellent. I leave it in D mode 95% of the time to be honest.  The fuel consumption means I get close to 200 miles a tank in filtering mode only.  I seldom ride on the open roads with it, but it copes more than adequately with that when I do.  I did change the rear shock for a Wilbers as I found it too soft for me as I am a big fellow and heavy'ish....

 

Best thing is to test ride a 750s DCT as they have the newer software on the DCT and are apparently better than the 700's.

[Guest CHB]

ad 1) I saw video of guy riding Integra 2014 for 160.000 km on dirt roads with no DCT problem, (and new Africa has also DCT )

ad 2) on Integra the seat is very poor - I have changed mine and now it's OK - Integra 2019  - but better seat is usually a little bit "higher" 

 

DCT is super, I can change geer if I thing it is useful for the road before me - but  I do not have to, I can just ride ... 

[thwartedEfforts 264]

a warm welcome to @CHB 

[Slowboy 20,360]

14 hours ago, thwartedEfforts said:

a warm welcome to @CHB 

 

+1

[DCTPaul 629]

Been riding geared bikes for 30+ Years and have had an additional Twist n Go Scooter in the garage for the Last 15 Years...

I loves my NC750X DCT! - Best of Both Worlds...

[dave 959]

I now agree with Paul about the DCT, although I've started using the Silverwing scooter again mainly for the weather protection and a better headlight.

[Graham NZ 1,186]

Hi Colin

 

Presumably you're thinking of a new S?  Good long test rides, with your pillion and over less well surfaced roads as well as motorways is highly recommended to show if the seats, power, brakes and suspension satisfy you.  Many people here have upgraded the suspension and seats. 

 

Left hand and left hip arthritis are what made me select a DCT.  It takes a little learning but that is fun.  Downside?  Slow manoeuvres are easier with a clutch lever to fan, especially if you prefer to lower your right foot when coming to a complete stop, as I need to because of left hip trouble.

 

I ride pretty slowly and so consistently get 28km/l which means about 300km before reserve.

 

The stock seat is naf but a Shad conversion is easy and effective.

 

For pillion carrying the front brake on NC bikes is marginal.  Of all the things I'd like to improve on my S it's the front brake.

 

I've ridden 650 V-Stroms and hate the way they are so tall and top heavy compared with my S and the way they steer isn't to my taste either.  They are much more powerful though and that you may miss with a pillion.

 

High mileage V-Stroms can give fueling problems.  The dual throttle system is great when going well but can be tricky to deal with if it gives trouble.  There is a hidden fuel filter in the top of the in-tank pump which tends to clog and that involves replacement of the top part of the pump.  Fuel starvation leads to replacement of the obvious intake filter at the bottom of the pump but that doesn't fix things.  Not all workshops know about the top filter...….  If you intend to do big mileage on an S be aware of the top filter issue.  Both my friend's Stroms had that trouble around 80k miles.

 

Stroms have a lot of good points but overall I prefer my S.

 

 

 

[roddy 845]

Just recently change from a 14 plate S Manual to a 16 plate S DCT the one with the red wheels and I am a total convert to DCT. Trying to get used to going 40 mph in 6th gear though in D mode. I love the way I can choose to ride in manual if I wish. PR5's going on today as well.

[Graham NZ 1,186]

Gareth

 

I rarely use D mode because I prefer the engine to spin more freely at speeds under 100km/h than D often delivers.

 

My preferred riding mode is MT when I make all the upward changes manually but leave most downward changes to the DCT.  To slow I prefer to use the brakes rather than forced down changes.

 

IMHO for DCT to work perfectly the bike needs a ride by wire throttle so than the system can self rev match the down changes.

[roddy 845]

Graham, I am finding I am using the MT mode more than the others and like you leave the DCT to do the downward changes.Its just nice having the options. Don't know what its like in NZ but a cruise control would be a nice option with all the average speed cameras that we have here in the UK.