GTX Engine Oil

[Tex 36,817]

1 hour ago, Steve Case said:

Just an added observation, I haven't seen a Honda listing for a set of replacement DCT clutch friction plates for either NC700 or 750 models which makes me think they supply the complete DCT clutch pack at over £500. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

Because of this I am very very wary of which engine oil is used  as a non-MA type may affect the clutch operation and if I bugger it up it could be an expensive lesson!

 

Just saying.

Steve, I can’t say I’m surprised. When we started converting the FJ clutches to slipper operation we quickly discovered that the correct deck (pack) height was essential for correct operation. This meant buying a shed load of plates and painstakingly measuring each one with a micrometer until we had the correct deck height with the right number of plates. I assume the DCT is equally sensitive to deck height and the only way to achieve it, economically, is to buy a pack that Honda have pre-measured.

[Steve Case 948]

 oooooooooooo thats scary stuff,  JASO MA all the way for me then...

[pjm 6,041]

Has anyone needed to replace DCT pads so far? 

[Steve Case 948]

I will put it here when it comes due which will be a while yet I suspect, however this bike is mainly for local journeys and spends 80% of its life in traffic so it may be earlier than others doing more motorway work.

However I can confidently predict it will be longer the the belt and rollers on a burgman 400.

[ted 5,734]

When I had my old x11, I'd bought it off a guy who worked for an oil co. He never rode the bike but he did polish it a lot, including the chain!

 

Anyway, he couldn't smoke in the house, so he'd go out and polish the bike and it seemed, change the oil. With the bulk can of car oil that he must have had.

 

Anyway 2, I bought the bike in better than new condition, honestly it was a thing of wonder. It had about 1100 miles on it and was a good few years old by then. Anyway 3, on my first long run out the bloody clutch failed, all revved up and not going to go!

 

I dismantled the the thing and found the friction material on the plates,  completely dissolved, just into a grey sludge at the bottom of the pan.

 

Don't use car oil unless it's guaranteed not to contain any "friction modifiers", nor anything that says suitable for diesel.

[suffolk58 2,286]

I had a "wrong oil" experience with a bike with a dry clutch!

I was riding my BMW R1200RT on the A1 just north of Newark, when it started to act like a giant CVT scooter. Opening the throttle caused increased revs, but very little forward motion.

The (very) expensive subsequent repair, showed that the gearbox oil seal had failed (a well known problem on 2005 bikes) and had converted the dry clutch to a wet one.

Replacing the clutch was so expensive, because the bike had to be split almost in half, to get to it. Way beyond my DIY skills.

[lipsee 1,351]

40 minutes ago, suffolk58 said:

I had a "wrong oil" experience with a bike with a dry clutch!

I was riding my BMW R1200RT on the A1 just north of Newark, when it started to act like a giant CVT scooter. Opening the throttle caused increased revs, but very little forward motion.

The (very) expensive subsequent repair, showed that the gearbox oil seal had failed (a well known problem on 2005 bikes) and had converted the dry clutch to a wet one.

Replacing the clutch was so expensive, because the bike had to be split almost in half, to get to it. Way beyond my DIY skills.

I too have an RT 2005,,, I had a similar problem ,,I was thrashing it ,went around a corner and lost all drive,,would only move in 1st gear... Turned out tobe a broken shaft in the box ,, replacement box and new clutch cost me £1400....

[Tex 36,817]

3 hours ago, lipsee said:

I too have an RT 2005,,, I had a similar problem ,,I was thrashing it ,went around a corner and lost all drive,,would only move in 1st gear... Turned out tobe a broken shaft in the box ,, replacement box and new clutch cost me £1400....

 

4 hours ago, suffolk58 said:

I had a "wrong oil" experience with a bike with a dry clutch!

I was riding my BMW R1200RT on the A1 just north of Newark, when it started to act like a giant CVT scooter. Opening the throttle caused increased revs, but very little forward motion.

The (very) expensive subsequent repair, showed that the gearbox oil seal had failed (a well known problem on 2005 bikes) and had converted the dry clutch to a wet one.

Replacing the clutch was so expensive, because the bike had to be split almost in half, to get to it. Way beyond my DIY skills.

Ouch! The ‘delights’ of BMW ownership! No wonder people get twitchy about owning one after the warranty has expired..  All my (earlier generation) boxers were trouble free and I would love another, but I doubt my ‘wimpy’ left wrist could cope with the clutch. 
 

[Steve Case 948]

Yup been there done that, I replaced the clutch plate on my R1100GS and it was a long and fiddly job that actually went fine until fitting the swingarm to the gearbox housing and cracked the housing by a combination of brute force and stupidity.

[Dave H 2,022]

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Steve Case said:

cracked the housing by a combination of brute force and stupidity.

 

I have those talents in just the correct ratio too.

[Steve Case 948]

Glad I'm not alone, luckily I managed to get the gearbox housing welded for a reasonable price. It did mean I ended up fitting the gearbox and swingarm twice.

[DCTPaul 629]

DCT - Dual Clutch Transmission...

So uses two of them there clutch packs at the £500 mark...

https://www.fowlersparts.co.uk/parts/6590865/nc750x-abs-dual-clutch/clutch-nc750xd

 

Castrol Power 1 10w30 Fully Synthetic is MA...

And when pouring out in to a meaduring jug, is such a lovely colour and smell, well it takes all my strength not to taste a little, not even a dab on my finger....

https://www.halfords.com/motoring/motorcycling/oils/castrol-power-1-racing-4t-10w%2F30-motorcycle-engine-oil---4ltr-966168.html

 

Honda SH125 Scoot says 10w30 MB... but MA is fine - just not 'tother way round, or vicky vercky...

[MatBin 5,080]

My R80RT, forget what year, single front disc, sloped single shocker, had it's clutch and gearbox bearings replaced by the dealer at well over 100,000 miles (probably 120/130K) as a "precaution" if memory serves me correctly, Hell of a reliable thing it was, battery went kaput and I almost had to disassemble the bike to get a new one in.

[lipsee 1,351]

On 4/27/2020 at 14:01, Tex said:

 

Ouch! The ‘delights’ of BMW ownership! No wonder people get twitchy about owning one after the warranty has expired..  All my (earlier generation) boxers were trouble free and I would love another, but I doubt my ‘wimpy’ left wrist could cope with the clutch. 
 

Giv me a break TEX,,it does have 78000 on the clock....  Would I buy a new one ??? Eeeeeeeeeeerrr No,,,,,   when I tested a new RT, it felt to me liike the quality had gone to pot...  My RT owes me nothing,,, she shakes rattles and roll and I just love her ( till the next big bill)....cheers

Edited April 28, 2020 by lipsee

[lipsee 1,351]

46 minutes ago, MatBin said:

My R80RT, forget what year, single front disc, sloped single shocker, had it's clutch and gearbox bearings replaced by the dealer at well over 100,000 miles (probably 120/130K) as a "precaution" if memory serves me correctly, Hell of a reliable thing it was, battery went kaput and I almost had to disassemble the bike to get a new one in.

Funny you should say that about the battery,,, Mine has never started with any enthusiasm !!   I know the garage I bought from, fitted a battery and they probably went the cheap skate route..So I always carry with me a starter battery.... ( even around Europe ((12 counties)

[Tex 36,817]

4 hours ago, lipsee said:

Giv me a break TEX,,it does have 78000 on the clock....  Would I buy a new one ??? Eeeeeeeeeeerrr No,,,,,   when I tested a new RT, it felt to me liike the quality had gone to pot...  My RT owes me nothing,,, she shakes rattles and roll and I just love her ( till the next big bill)....cheers

I guess the question is, would you buy another old(er) one? I think I would. If I could manage the clutch. Using it, not replacing it..  

 

The guy who assists Canary Motorcycle Tours (as tour guide) has an ‘08 1200GS and it dropped a valve the week before I got there in January. But at 340k km I think it had every right. The cheapest way out was to get a used engine from the UK (68k miles) and fit that. They put a new clutch in while it was apart, purely as a precaution. He bought it new, doesn’t have a car, and it’s served him very well. 

[Steve Case 948]

I did like my R11GS and the punishment it could take, the ride quality on poor surfaces and the range. But I also remember the huge weight which affected the roll on performance, the fairly poor gearbox and the unnecessarily complex wiring.

 

I have considered getting another but I think would have to consider a number of things such as complexity and would maybe prefer an older rebuilt bike as spares for BMWs are still easy to get and reasonably priced.

[alhendo1 3,042]

20 hours ago, Tex said:

I guess the question is, would you buy another old(er) one? I think I would. If I could manage the clutch. Using it, not replacing it..  

 

The guy who assists Canary Motorcycle Tours (as tour guide) has an ‘08 1200GS and it dropped a valve the week before I got there in January. But at 340k km I think it had every right. The cheapest way out was to get a used engine from the UK (68k miles) and fit that. They put a new clutch in while it was apart, purely as a precaution. He bought it new, doesn’t have a car, and it’s served him very well. 

Tex. I was talking with Martin about this and I'm sure along the bikes journey Jose has removed as much electronics as possible to keep it more reliable. ..if I remember correctly it had some kind of Esa adjustment and he swapped it out for top notch standard Ohlins shocks.

[Tex 36,817]

3 hours ago, alhendo1 said:

Tex. I was talking with Martin about this and I'm sure along the bikes journey Jose has removed as much electronics as possible to keep it more reliable. ..if I remember correctly it had some kind of Esa adjustment and he swapped it out for top notch standard Ohlins shocks.

Yep, that’s exactly right. The bike originally had the first generation ESA and when it packed up (as they all seem to, eventually) rather than buy the same again he fitted Ohlins. I would too.  They never went into detail about what else (if anything) they have neutered.

 

All this high tech wizardry is cool if you’re changing your bike every time the warranty expires, but if you’re buying long term I would get the most basic spec possible and then add quality parts as and when. If your TFT dash goes out four years down the road you’ll be wondering what you ever saw in it! 

[Rocker66 34,406]

8 minutes ago, Tex said:

Yep, that’s exactly right. The bike originally had the first generation ESA and when it packed up (as they all seem to, eventually) rather than buy the same again he fitted Ohlins. I would too.  They never went into detail about what else (if anything) they have neutered.

 

All this high tech wizardry is cool if you’re changing your bike every time the warranty expires, but if you’re buying long term I would get the most basic spec possible and then add quality parts as and when. If your TFT dash goes out four years down the road you’ll be wondering what you ever saw in it! 

If only I could buy a brand new R75/5 or R75/6 with the same build quality that they had I would be a happy man.

[alhendo1 3,042]

43 minutes ago, Tex said:

They never went into detail about what else (if anything) they have neutered.

I think as much as he could...Martin did mention other stuff but I can't remember what....to bring the bike back to basics....if it's thrown a valve at 340k I'd say whatever he's done has been successful😊

[skorpion 945]

19 hours ago, Rocker66 said:

If only I could buy a brand new R75/5 or R75/6 with the same build quality that they had I would be a happy man.

 

Back in the day my brother bought a new Honda CB750 and then BMW came out with the R75/5.

 

We went on a test day at the BMW dealers and afterwards the conclusion we both came to was the BMW was the best advert for the Honda CB750 as it was like going back in time. lol

[Rocker66 34,406]

11 minutes ago, skorpion said:

 

Back in the day my brother bought a new Honda CB750 and then BMW came out with the R75/5.

 

We went on a test day at the BMW dealers and afterwards the conclusion we both came to was the BMW was the best advert for the Honda CB750 as it was like going back in time. lol

I have owned both and certainly preferred the R75/5. Having said that when I first bought the BMW I thought I had done the wrong thing but I persevered and after a short tame became used to it’s ways and went on ave some great times on it including my first visit to the TT.. it certainly wasn’t. Bike that you could judge by a short test  ride.

[Steve Case 948]

I third what rocker 66 said, I would have bought the R1150RT as it was my favourite looking of all the post airhead but the ridiculous ABS Servo put me off.

 

They are a touring bike so weight is less of an issue, the gearbox I can live with as long as the early 6 speed issues have been dealt with but a servo!!!! did a steering wheel come as an option?