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sams700

New Bike to sort back pain?

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sams700
Posted (edited)

Since lockdown I have been riding a little more and doing about 200 miles on a weekend or even a day. However, I get crippling mid to lower back pain.  I have no idea what causes this - I sit forward, lean forward, sit back, balance on my legs (rather than being a sack of potatoes) - etc etc.  This happens within about 50 miles and then simply carries on.

 

Nothing works. I have tried a back support, changing position etc. I dont know what causes it and therefore can't seem to work out why the position does not work. The bike is a KTM 790 Duke and it is comfortable - lots of legroom, plenty of space to move around on the seat - forward and back, bars are relatively high and wide. I have a screen on, so am not hanging for grim death.

 

Been to a doctor and had my back x-rayed and all they could find was that my back had some dehydration between the bones in my back, and that the lack of cushioning was causing pain. So I thought something forward leaning would be beneficial, not so. I do stretch etc, and do not have any issues in other activities (cycling etc). I think my core is OK as I stretch most days.

 

I think I was more comfortable on the Harley, but I do not want a Harley again and anyway, I did not do long days on it.  I know a sports bike will not work. I also had a Honda silverwing which was the same and I was in acute pain and a fazer 600 (years ago).  I think the closest that was the most comfortable was a honda vfr.

 

I think I may try some risers and a higher seat, as its cheaper than changing bike!

 

Has anyone had something similar and how did you solve it?

 

Also am I best hiring a bike that I consider so I can do a long day and see how I cope?

 

thanks

 

 

Edited by sams700
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Tel

As many on this forum will know, once you have orthopaedic injuries or issues it's a slippery slope of endlessly searching for the bike that suits best.

I bought a Harley Sportster 3 months ago [during lockdown/ so no test ride] and it's crippling me despite the lower seat [which was the reason I bought it].

I've been to check out another bike today, which felt really nice, and I'm waiting for a call from the dealer to see if we can do a deal.

Three of the best bikes I've had for my problems were the FZS1000 Fazer, Blackbird and R1100S BMW.

 

Good luck with your search!

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crazyhorse

A foam seat pad and sheepskin helped my back.

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sandalfarm

Brufen  400mg  20 min before  you set off cures everything 

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poldark

I've got same lack of squishy stuff (medical term!) on lower 2/3 vertebrae, apparently it's genetic.

 

Anyways been using a Chiropractor for many years, a few times each year as things built up, it's only for relief and to keep upper back in balance as it overcompensates, sadly can't be cured.

 

But what's made a huge difference in the past few years is Pilates, if I can I do two classes a week and this has really helped my core and lower back strength, resulting in significantly reducing Chiropractor visits. Stretches help but won't achieve what properly done exercises can.

 

Luckily my local gym is council owned and has half price classes for over-50s, so my two weekly classes cost £6.50.  I know people who pay £10+ for a single class.

 

Maybe have a go.

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Grumpy old man
11 minutes ago, sandalfarm said:

Brufen  400mg  20 min before  you set off cures everything 

And a whisky on return. 

 Try softening the suspension so you're not getting continues pounding on the spine I had a the same problem on the Crf250l, I used a gel padding on the seat and it's helped.

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sams700
2 hours ago, Tel said:

As many on this forum will know, once you have orthopaedic injuries or issues it's a slippery slope of endlessly searching for the bike that suits best.

I bought a Harley Sportster 3 months ago [during lockdown/ so no test ride] and it's crippling me despite the lower seat [which was the reason I bought it].

I've been to check out another bike today, which felt really nice, and I'm waiting for a call from the dealer to see if we can do a deal.

Three of the best bikes I've had for my problems were the FZS1000 Fazer, Blackbird and R1100S BMW.

 

Good luck with your search!

I had a sportster and if you have mid pegs, try and change them for forwards, made a huge difference to me.

 

If you have forwards already then perhaps a single seat that has a small flip up backrest thing, so you can push your back into the rest.

 

Feel free to pm me if you want to discuss more

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Jamesco

After months of lockdown we were asked to come back to work a couple of weeks ago, within a week I could barely stand up straight - suddenly got very sharp pains in my lower back. I'd done next to bugger all excerise for a good while - usually would be walking, swimming, scuba diving, pushing around the lump that is my NC...hardly ever at a gym mind you

 

I'll also be going to the doctors also for advice & an xray. Usually my opinion of  visiting the doc is that whatever ailment is not serious enough or too late already (stupidly). All I can think is I've been working from a little laptop on the dining table for months, then suddenly jumped up & tried to be active again so just wasn't ready for it. While waiting for some good advice I've been doing some gentle stretching & yoga - plenty of beginners yoga for men on YouTube, I am no contortionist

 

Strangely on the bike it is very comfortable & doesn't make the pain any worse. Steady away on good roads & the Shad seat I guess

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Foxy

Might sound a bit daft but an easy way to get a bad back is carrying a wallet or anything in trouser back pockets and sitting down, similar thing riding with a wallet in front trouser pockets, great if you're looking to get cramp.

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gonzo

AH the numb  bum club , ! welcome !  I also been doing a few miles in the last few weeks , and i have just had my saddle refurbished , the guy who did it said the NC saddle was the hardest he had worked on , (density ) its now with 2" of depth with some sort of memory foam and slightly raised at the front , it does feel a lot more comfortable but iv yet to do a long run .Cost £70 inc vat,  I put up with it for 3 years and tried the sheepskin ( cheep) and although it helped a little it wasnt a cure .! 

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Hickky

Well, I don't get any lower back pain on the Kwak (June) even after a 200 mile ride. However my right hip gets stiff and it's often not that easy to get off. Sometimes I have to shuffle my ass rearwards until I dismount over the back of the bike, bending the rear indicators.

Why don't I have any LBP with very deteriorated discs between the vertebrae? Well I do have permanent sciatica in my left foot controlled by drugs that are very safe. Secondly I have had three back operations to stop a disc rupture ramming into my spinal chord. Thirdly I have a spinal chord stimulation system built in under my skin. I have to recharge this system every two weeks via a plate recharger. It has a remote control to adjust the level of pain relief!

So my answer is see a Neurosurgeon, go under the knife and let them sort it out. LB pain is a message from the body to the brain that something ain't right so go fix it! Residual pain is dealt with drugs that work on the nervous system in your brain. (All pain is actually felt in the brain) TENS machines and the like can provide temporary relief, but to really sort it, get under the knife.

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Rev Ken

I've a rounded back (hereditary) so have to keep my core strength up as it is so easy to put my back out. Normally twice a week Gym visits keep me fit enough to ride, however riding with feet forward (on a scooter) nearly killed me! a 'sporting' posture strains my neck, so need an upright position with the foot pegs in a position that allows me to take the weight off my back, especially over rough bits. I've got my bars on my BMW F800GT raised and brought back a bit (had to extend the brake hose). I also have a 'comfort' seat.

 

When touring the continent and Baltic states with a group on my CBF1000 I fitted an 'Airhawk' pad to the seat. It is an air pillow which you can blow up to the right amount. Too much and you are wobbling, but if you partially blow it up so that your backside just touches the saddle, it is surprisingly comfortable. It might be at least a partial solution.

 

Just hope something works for you and you can 'relax' on your bike!

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sams700

I had a friend look at my posture and I maybe making things worse by pushing back with my hips and the arching my back at precisely the wrong spot. 

 

Going to check some pilates on YouTube and think about how I sit on my bike

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Scootabout

I've had a few twinges on and off the bike and I wonder if lockdown's to blame - less exercise (muscle atrophy) and more alcohol (dehydration). Not severe, but a factor, I think. 

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PoppetM
On 03/08/2020 at 20:36, Hickky said:

 TENS machines and the like can provide temporary relief


Brilliant bit of kit! Slipped a disc years ago, hadn’t touched the nerve to put me through the roof but I lost feeling in my left leg and some Diazepam which I didn’t get in with. We had a TENs for my Dad but was scared to use it. Mam whacked the pads on and I stretched out on the floor and let it work. Dad looking worried over the coffee table “does it hurt”, no it’s bloody great. He tells Mam to turn it up, “I can’t she is on the maximum setting”.

 

1 minute ago, Scootabout said:

I've had a few twinges on and off the bike and I wonder if lockdown's to blame - less exercise (muscle atrophy) and more alcohol (dehydration). Not severe, but a factor, I think. 


I think it is. I have been sat in a dining chair for past four months and I haven’t been leaving the house during the week. Last week I started getting spidery pains in my left shoulder and my left leg has been going to sleep again. New office chair arrived for me today, shoulder pain virtually vanished immediately. I have been out on my Paddleboard tonight for four and a half miles, but I am feeling it in my lower back, my leg and feet kept on with pins and needles which was irritating.

 

Need to keep moving! Remember even at work you were probably moving around more in the workplace then you do at home! 

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fred_jb
3 hours ago, PoppetM said:


Brilliant bit of kit! Slipped a disc years ago, hadn’t touched the nerve to put me through the roof but I lost feeling in my left leg and some Diazepam which I didn’t get in with. We had a TENs for my Dad but was scared to use it. Mam whacked the pads on and I stretched out on the floor and let it work. Dad looking worried over the coffee table “does it hurt”, no it’s bloody great. He tells Mam to turn it up, “I can’t she is on the maximum setting”.

 


I think it is. I have been sat in a dining chair for past four months and I haven’t been leaving the house during the week. Last week I started getting spidery pains in my left shoulder and my left leg has been going to sleep again. New office chair arrived for me today, shoulder pain virtually vanished immediately. I have been out on my Paddleboard tonight for four and a half miles, but I am feeling it in my lower back, my leg and feet kept on with pins and needles which was irritating.

 

Need to keep moving! Remember even at work you were probably moving around more in the workplace then you do at home! 

 

You should get that checked out, especially if you are getting pains in both legs, or any numbness in (how to put this delicately) the area that would be in contact with a bicycle saddle!  If so you could have cauda equina syndrome which is what I was diagnosed with recently.   Fortunately my symptoms eased fairly quickly and the compression of my spinal cord, although classed as severe, was borderline for emergency surgery, so the consultant decided that I did not need an operation immediately.  However, this can be a serious condition and in some cases can lead to paralysis and incontinence if not treated promptly.

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Jamesco

Same here @PoppetM, sat at the dining table for months using a laptop so hunched over/head angled down a little

 

I went to the doctors yesterday for an x-ray, nothing major visible apart from spine straighter than he expected (indicating muscle spasm?) but kindly recommended 12 weeks of physiotherapy... insufficient core strength is probably the answer for me @Rev Ken I've been a couch potato recently

 

Next pandemic I will be better prepared!

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PoppetM
5 hours ago, fred_jb said:

 

You should get that checked out, especially if you are getting pains in both legs, or any numbness in (how to put this delicately) the area that would be in contact with a bicycle saddle!  If so you could have cauda equina syndrome which is what I was diagnosed with recently.   Fortunately my symptoms eased fairly quickly and the compression of my spinal cord, although classed as severe, was borderline for emergency surgery, so the consultant decided that I did not need an operation immediately.  However, this can be a serious condition and in some cases can lead to paralysis and incontinence if not treated promptly.


Thanks Fred, luckily in my case it’s just a moving disc. It happens a now and then, but a few weeks of behaving and doing the physio exercises they gave me when it first happened sorts it out, it’s my core muscles weakening from inactivity. Will get some more hours in on the paddleboard. (At least it’s not caused by my bike 😉🤣)

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Exceledsteve

Just off out on the paddle board now. I've lost 10kg of unnecessary weight in the last 3 months through regular exercise (mostly paddle boarding) and eating less. Although it can cause a little lower muscular back ache it's short lived and I feel better now than I have felt in decades. The regular exercise is key to maintaining your body for everyday stuff. Keep moving.

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poldark

When I was first thinking about avoiding the London Congestion Charge by getting a scooter, which eventually led to DAS completion, I asked my Chiropractor about riding a bike and whether it'd be bad for my iffy back.

 

I'll admit I was nervous he'd poo poo the plan, but I was surprised he said it would be a good thing and likely benefit me, apparently the whole balancing thing we all do whilst riding activates micro-muscles that are others often inactive.

 

Guess paddle boarding would do the same too. 

 

Also before deciding to go out for local "shopping" trips during lockdown I did a bit of Googling and motorbike riding is considered "low impact exercise" following several studies.  And that's ignoring the mental benefits we're all well aware of.

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Griff
On 8/3/2020 at 14:21, sams700 said:

Since lockdown I have been riding a little more and doing about 200 miles on a weekend or even a day. However, I get crippling mid to lower back pain.  I have no idea what causes this - I sit forward, lean forward, sit back, balance on my legs (rather than being a sack of potatoes) - etc etc.  This happens within about 50 miles and then simply carries on.

 

Nothing works. I have tried a back support, changing position etc. I dont know what causes it and therefore can't seem to work out why the position does not work. The bike is a KTM 790 Duke and it is comfortable - lots of legroom, plenty of space to move around on the seat - forward and back, bars are relatively high and wide. I have a screen on, so am not hanging for grim death.

 

Been to a doctor and had my back x-rayed and all they could find was that my back had some dehydration between the bones in my back, and that the lack of cushioning was causing pain. So I thought something forward leaning would be beneficial, not so. I do stretch etc, and do not have any issues in other activities (cycling etc). I think my core is OK as I stretch most days.

 

I think I was more comfortable on the Harley, but I do not want a Harley again and anyway, I did not do long days on it.  I know a sports bike will not work. I also had a Honda silverwing which was the same and I was in acute pain and a fazer 600 (years ago).  I think the closest that was the most comfortable was a honda vfr.

 

I think I may try some risers and a higher seat, as its cheaper than changing bike!

 

Has anyone had something similar and how did you solve it?

 

Also am I best hiring a bike that I consider so I can do a long day and see how I cope?

 

thanks

 

 

 

Because I am an X-Adv owner You may think I am being funny by suggesting one. However my reasons are that with the optional footpegs added, this bike offers a variety of seating positions. You mention being comfortable on a Harley. The X-Adv can almost replicate the Harley riding position because You can put your feet completely forward. The seat on the X-Adv (hereafter referred to as the X)  is substantial and long, thereby facilitating moving around.  I sometimes find the feet forward position a little achey on my back over long periods so that is when I pop down the footpegs which bring my feet completely back almost like rearsets. That then places me leaning forwards towards the bars and my back angle is changed substantially. On really rough roads I stand on those pegs and the standing position on this bike ie one of the best of all. It is way better than my 250 CRF which probably needs risers. 

 

All of the above mean that the X is the bike that I most use. Long trips, short trips, tours abroad, it does them all. I suggest getting a spin on one, preferably with the footpegs mounted so You can also get to try out that aspect.   Only downside of the bike is that the seat height is quite tall. I am only 5'8" but I have kangaroo legs at 32" inseam so not a problem for me. 

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Scootabout
Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, PoppetM said:

 

Need to keep moving! Remember even at work you were probably moving around more in the workplace then you do at home! 

 

Yes, I think that's right. Normally we all move around a lot more than during lockdown. I've started upping my exercise regime a bit to compensate. It used to be a short jog or walk per day. Now I get out twice, and do about 40 mins walking or some walking /jogging, in total.  I still think it might not be enough.  (Good point you made about posture, too. It's easy to overlook having the right chair, monitor height etc - all the stuff they check at work - when you're at home.)

Edited by Scootabout
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Haggard Rider

Prior to my disc popping, I'd been to a Physio who told me when it hurt to keep my back 'open'. Basically, this meant doing Eddie the Eagle squats! Worked though.

 

Now since the pop, my back is so much better than it's ever been and I certainly don't get back ache on the bike, but, even so, I have found raising my heels with the balls of my feet on the pegs, like standing on tips toes but sitting down, takes stress of the butt so, since this position naturally 'opens' the back, it may just bring you some relief?

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Hickky

Have I just walked into a parallel universe? My regular exercise regime? What has come over everybody? My regime is mainly jumping to conclusions!

Mind you I 'dropped' a picnic table today, having got off scoot for a 'eat out to help out' 50% off meal, got the first draught lager (Starpronen) in my hands since December 2019, straddled the built in bench and.........

My weight was obviously (I found out since) more than is provided by the counter weight of the table, it's legs did not come out far enough to fully support the sitting bench and, beer in my left hand, the whole plot tipped up and I landed on my back with the picnic table above my legs. Irony is I had just taken off the crash helmet, but I didn't hit my head anyway. Skin off my right ankle and a little gravel rash on my elbows is all that happened, oh and the Starpronen went  flying over my head, breaking the glass and the contents all over the deck. So much for the first draught lager of the year,. Told you I shouldn't drink and drive, but crashing a picnic table, that's just the kind of guy I am!

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poldark
7 hours ago, Hickky said:

Have I just walked into a parallel universe? My regular exercise regime? What has come over everybody? My regime is mainly jumping to conclusions!

Mind you I 'dropped' a picnic table today, having got off scoot for a 'eat out to help out' 50% off meal, got the first draught lager (Starpronen) in my hands since December 2019, straddled the built in bench and.........

My weight was obviously (I found out since) more than is provided by the counter weight of the table, it's legs did not come out far enough to fully support the sitting bench and, beer in my left hand, the whole plot tipped up and I landed on my back with the picnic table above my legs. Irony is I had just taken off the crash helmet, but I didn't hit my head anyway. Skin off my right ankle and a little gravel rash on my elbows is all that happened, oh and the Starpronen went  flying over my head, breaking the glass and the contents all over the deck. So much for the first draught lager of the year,. Told you I shouldn't drink and drive, but crashing a picnic table, that's just the kind of guy I am!

 

A true rebel, maybe someone's trying to tell you something! 😄😄

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