Valve clearance question

[trisaki 2,029]

You are looking  for T1 for left hand cylinder  and t2 for right hand 

[rjp996 1,091]

On 11/25/2020 at 07:14, davebike said:

Simple way I was taught 40odd years ago at Suzuki turn engine forward until inlet valve on cylinder you working on opens and closes use a TDC guage or a small screwdriver to find

 

My tip from painful experience is not to use a chopstick to find TDC down the sparkplug hole  - tried it on my lawn tractor and found chopsticks snap easily - turned a quick job into a long one to remove the head to clean out to the Asia eating implement.... ive added that to my list of things ive learned over the past 50 years not to do ;-) 

[Dunnster 1,650]

[Xactly 5,384]

Does anyone recommend the use of four feeler gauges? There used to be interminable posts on the BMW oilhead forums about how you need to prevent the adjustment of one of a pair of valves affecting its mate on the same rocker shaft by inserting two feeler gauges, one under each pair of valves? Lights blue touch paper and retires.....

[Steve698 11]

7 hours ago, trisaki said:

When you refer to what cylinder  is what you should  really be pointing towards  the front  of the bike as like the pictures in parts manuals etc (Fowler's etc ) so number  1 cylinder is left hand ie gear lever side  gets confusing if you start mentioning  looking  at the valves or looking  from clutch side 

Not saying looking from clutch side, saying cylinder 1 is on the same side as the clutch and cylinder 2 is on the same side as the brake that's perfectly clear whether your sitting on the floor in front of the forks or sitting on the bike facing forwards the brake and the clutch don't move.

[Slowboy 20,426]

15 hours ago, Xactly said:

Does anyone recommend the use of four feeler gauges? There used to be interminable posts on the BMW oilhead forums about how you need to prevent the adjustment of one of a pair of valves affecting its mate on the same rocker shaft by inserting two feeler gauges, one under each pair of valves? Lights blue touch paper and retires.....

No, but then I was taught in a Royal Naval Dockyard on big old diesels, and small fire pumps. Setting the valves on a Rover gas turbine fire pump was confusing though😎😂😂

 

And it came from a BMW forum, so they probably had to specify platinum feelers that were gold plated for better “feel” as well 😂😂

[Andy m 23,513]

What, you mean you can't just spin the pushrod and assume by how many turns it continues after you let go that it's OK? Works on Bullets. 

 

I recall the BMWC claiming feeler gauges supplied in the tool kit had the "correct tolerance" as in 0.009 +2/-0 as against 0.010 +/-1 used on "common Japanese and others". I think they all go to dealers now, done by the laying on of hands and teleporter for £120/hr.

 

Andy

[Xactly 5,384]

It was the Americans who advocated this approach. I tried it once and found it made no noticeable difference, nor could I see why it might. I’ve long since given up obsessing about micron accuracy in setting valve clearances, especially on those that don’t rev highly.

[Tex 36,817]

16 hours ago, Xactly said:

Does anyone recommend the use of four feeler gauges? There used to be interminable posts on the BMW oilhead forums about how you need to prevent the adjustment of one of a pair of valves affecting its mate on the same rocker shaft by inserting two feeler gauges, one under each pair of valves? Lights blue touch paper and retires.....

I think that approach was strictly BMW oil head related. Never felt the need to do that on a Japanese (or modern Triumph) engine. But they don’t have sloppy rocker to rocker shaft clearances..  

 

Actually, come to think of it, I didn’t do it on my oil head either.  

 

BMW forums are a huge source of amusement in things like that and, sadly, a couple of Triumph ones aren’t far behind. 

[Xactly 5,384]

Yep, I know what you mean about certain Triumph forums...

[Andy m 23,513]

Do I detect a hint of "They all do that SssssirrrrrR" syndrome? 

 

Sloppy rocker shafts can't be their fault, how could they charge what they do and provide sloppy rocker shafts. Therefore the tumble dryer full of rusty bolts noise must be the owners fault. Hence the invention of the 4 gold plated, logo'd and correctly serviced feeler gauge requirement. 

 

I had it with lamps. Brake and tail light kept failing. Nothing to do with the loom rubbing through where the cable tie was only round the frame not the loom, my fault for buying replacement lamps at Halfords. BMW filament lamps are tougher, work fine with an intermittent short to positive . 

 

Andy

Edited November 27, 2020 by Andy m

[MatBin 5,081]

22 hours ago, trisaki said:

When you refer to what cylinder  is what you should  really be pointing towards  the front  of the bike as like the pictures in parts manuals etc (Fowler's etc ) so number  1 cylinder is left hand ie gear lever side  gets confusing if you start mentioning  looking  at the valves or looking  from clutch side 

Agreed, or use the more understood terms near-side and off-side?

Edited November 27, 2020 by MatBin

[MatBin 5,081]

2 minutes ago, Andy m said:

Do I detect a hint of "They all do that SssssirrrrrR" syndrome? 

 

my fault for buying replacement lamps at Halfords. BMW filament lamps are tougher, work fine with an intermittent dead short. 

 

Andy

BMW only recommend their screen fluid for their cars, use anything else and if it blocks you're looking at £100+ to flush by BMW technician.

[Andy m 23,513]

4 minutes ago, MatBin said:

Agreed, or use the more understood terms near-side and off-side?

A potential world of pain. 

 

On training I've encountered left and right referenced from standing on the kerb (front and rear to the normals) and nearside as closest to the dotted white paint line, ie nearest the other traffic. This is before the ones who don't know left from right and/or believe lane 6 on the M1 is the normal driving lane going north (you'd go in lane 1 southbound unless overtaking). 

 

On the same side (or not) as a feature (steering wheel, chain etc) is the way with such not-rights. 

 

Andy

[MatBin 5,081]

12 minutes ago, Andy m said:

A potential world of pain. 

 

On training I've encountered left and right referenced from standing on the kerb (front and rear to the normals) and nearside as closest to the dotted white paint line, ie nearest the other traffic. This is before the ones who don't know left from right and/or believe lane 6 on the M1 is the normal driving lane going north (you'd go in lane 1 southbound unless overtaking). 

 

On the same side (or not) as a feature (steering wheel, chain etc) is the way with such not-rights. 

 

Andy

Clutch side is no good for a dct bike though

[ChrisCB 6,671]

23 minutes ago, MatBin said:

BMW only recommend their screen fluid for their cars, use anything else and if it blocks you're looking at £100+ to flush by BMW technician.

That's because cheaper screen wash contains additives that's cause heated washer jets to clog up, are not very good at cleaning plastic headlamp covers and isn't great at shifting bug guts. If you're one of those that don't use your washers much you'll get fungus growth in your washer bottle and it stinks! 

[outrunner 4,457]

13 minutes ago, MatBin said:

Clutch side is no good for a dct bike though

Both DCT clutches are on the same side as manual bikes.

 

Andy

[ChrisCB 6,671]

5 minutes ago, outrunner said:

Both DCT clutches are on the same side as manual bikes.

 

Andy

The clutch lever isn't.

[Tex 36,817]

8 minutes ago, outrunner said:

Both DCT clutches are on the same side as manual bikes.

 

Andy

I think (loosing the will to live here) they’re referring to clutch side/throttle side not where the actual clutch is located in the engine. 
 

Edit: posted at same time as Chris. 

Edited November 27, 2020 by Tex

[listener 11,180]

23 hours ago, rjp996 said:

 

My tip from painful experience is not to use a chopstick to find TDC down the sparkplug hole  - tried it on my lawn tractor and found chopsticks snap easily - turned a quick job into a long one to remove the head to clean out to the Asia eating implement.... ive added that to my list of things ive learned over the past 50 years not to do ;-) 

 

Just as well you used a chopstick and not a part of your anatomy (ohh Matron!) ... 

[MatBin 5,081]

2 minutes ago, listener said:

 

Just as well you used a chopstick and not a part of your anatomy (ohh Matron!) ... 

Guy I worked with used his index finger to feel for a protrusion on the flywheel on a mini, hit the remote starter in the engine bay and got the end of his finger sliced off. Bit awkward as he was right handed, the chopped finger was on his right hand and he was a contract draughtsman.

[MatBin 5,081]

56 minutes ago, Chris750 said:

The clutch lever isn't.

Beat me to it

Edited November 27, 2020 by MatBin

[listener 11,180]

Just now, MatBin said:

Guy I worked with used his index finger to feel for a protrusion on the flywheel on a mini, hit the remote starter in the engine bay and got the end of his finger sliced off. Bit awkward as he was right handed, the chopped finger was on his right hand and he was a contract draughtsman.

 

Yes, some folks are well up the list for a Darwin Award! 

 

I can remember tales of folk checking fuel injectors by sticking a finger over the end, folk clearing crushing machines with their hands or feet ... etc. 

[MatBin 5,081]

1 hour ago, Chris750 said:

That's because cheaper screen wash contains additives that's cause heated washer jets to clog up, are not very good at cleaning plastic headlamp covers and isn't great at shifting bug guts. If you're one of those that don't use your washers much you'll get fungus growth in your washer bottle and it stinks! 

I bought a bottle of their stuff, £25, haven't used it yet, sold the BMW 3 months ago. I did find my 3 series very aerodynamic as it rarely got a dirty screen, my Focus went through screen wash at an alarming rate as both front and rear screen got filthy, used any old cheap stuff in that, wasn't in the reservoir long enough to go "off".

[Grumpy old man 4,673]

1 hour ago, listener said:

Yes, some folks are well up the list for a Darwin Award

Come on who hasn't done something stupid in that split second without thinking? I certainly won't be casting the first stone. I remember once when I was electric welding a crash cage in the stock car I use to race my mate was holding the bar while I was getting a tack on it but the sparks were burning his hand , I wet a rag ans said hold it with that so you won't get burnt, well of course as soon as I I touched the electrode he made a perfect earth  Sent him flying across the room I/he was lucky but we certainly had a few laughs about it later in the pub. Oh to be 18 again.