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Crappy DCT or not


Guest Firebladeaid

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Guest Firebladeaid

I came on to see if anyone had issues, I Have the 750s DCT and its now done about 1,200 miles,  I have tended to ride in S mode most of the time too  cos  in D mode its changing up far too early (2000 rpm) in town traffic !!  some times leaves me being overtook by Nissan Micras !!

 I would have expected it to hold the gears slightly longer,  maybe the DCT brains is not as good as I would have liked,

"S mode you say" but that  tends to hold on too long,     Phew I hear you say I don't want much,  Just a smoother ride in town.

Now my other question is I feel that from start up the bike tends to be "Hunting" on the fuel side give it a jerky ride till well warmed up but even then in S mode with the "hunting" still noticeable on feathering, steady on the throttle or over run the bloody thing is changing up and down , to be truthful I expected better than this,  its now changing gear when cranked over sometimes which it never seemed to do which in some circumstances is not good !!

 

Anyone else have these symptoms ??

Had its first service at 600 and computer readouts seemed all good

 

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I've started using manual mode more often at lower speeds. I find that in 'D' mode the gearbox changes gear too much at the wrong moment. Also the suspension upsets my right hand throttle position ove

It all sounds very odd to me, I've done 6k miles on my 750 X DCT and hardly had any probs with the gear changes in S or D modes. Maybe a few times in slow traffic where it's changed up or down unexpe

I can get mine flustered if I decelerate very sharply from speed then ask for full power exiting a bend.  It doesn't seem to able to catch up quick enough.  But that doesn't happen enough to be a prob

embee

Try the supposed ECU reset procedure (still not 100% sure if it does anything, but it's free so nothing to lose). If it is indeed a valid procedure the hope is it learns the fuelling correction for stoichiometric feedback from the map, so if anything should minimise hunting due to fuelling swings (maybe). Search for ECU reset or similar, you'll find it. It takes about 15mins of warm-up, so not long. Under normal riding it should achieve closed loop within a minute or so, and be pretty much up to temp in a mile or 2.

 

The other thing is that in S mode you can force an upshift (use + button) providing it's in an appropriate speed range for the gear. In D it upshifts as early as it can so using the + button doesn't work (only the - button giving downshifts). The S mode is supposed to be adaptive to some extent and learns your riding style. If you force upshifts earlier than it would otherwise do it on a regular basis it should start to do it itself after a while. I used this a lot recently while in the Alps and continually using S on the mountain roads but forcing earlier upshifts, and I'd say it does seem to work, after a few trips like this it was definitely doing earlier upshifts..

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Guest machinman

I've had the 700 and the 750 and the fueling/mapping was definitely better on the 700.

On the 750(DCT) I find jerkiness around 9-10 mph and also like you said a little hesitant when cold, a problem I never experienced with the 700.

Regarding the shifting in the different modes, I agree it's not perfect (what is?)

I tend to play around with the modes during the journey. I presume as DCT evolves you could probably tailor it to your own requirements.

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baben

I have started to use manual mode and find it is great in town and generally gives me a better ride all round though I find I am hitting the rev limiter now and then!

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rjp996

I have the 750x dct and seems to work well to me - done 5,500 miles over the past 2 months traveling in and out of London. I use it mostly in D and find it snaps through traffic ok, only when you want instant 'go' at say 40 do I use S.

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I've started using manual mode more often at lower speeds. I find that in 'D' mode the gearbox changes gear too much at the wrong moment. Also the suspension upsets my right hand throttle position over pothole/speed humps and the gearbox chnges up and down too much. Can't get along with 'S' mode as it seems to stay in gear too long. I havent tried doing manual changes in 'S' mode yet. That something else to explore. It is nice to have all these options though and it make the bike very flexible.

Edited by djsb
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Mikdent

It all sounds very odd to me, I've done 6k miles on my 750 X DCT and hardly had any probs with the gear changes in S or D modes.

Maybe a few times in slow traffic where it's changed up or down unexpectedly, and I mean just a few times in 6k miles and 18 months of ownership.

Has your S DCT been like this from new?

Maybe there's nowt wrong and the bike is not suited to you?

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Dave H

I can get mine flustered if I decelerate very sharply from speed then ask for full power exiting a bend.  It doesn't seem to able to catch up quick enough.  But that doesn't happen enough to be a problem and I can always bang down the gears using the paddle if it is.

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Guest bonekicker

The only way to find out if yours is running ok is to test ride another bike--then you will know for sure if the dealer needs to set yours up correctly --or it's you that needs to try riding in different modes--I have never tried the DCT even though --with all the aches and pains in hands it would be benificial--I still like the power to override the trottle with my clutch lever  :thumbsup:

 

Don't lose heart you will one way or tudder you will sort it and start enjoying the bike to it's full potential. :D

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baben

Have to say, in town I use sport, on twisties I use sport and for just cruising I use drive. Also use drive when my Yorkshireness wants more miles per litre. I also tend to override the box going down rather than up - the box seems to have learned my preferences over time. Auto gear changes, when they happen, are so smooth I often do not notice them. The advantage with manual is that changes are instant as well as smooth, with no hesitation at all and you can hang on to a gear until you want to change, not when the bike wants to.  It is like a very superior quickshifter.

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Guest Firebladeaid

It all sounds very odd to me, I've done 6k miles on my 750 X DCT and hardly had any probs with the gear changes in S or D modes.

Maybe a few times in slow traffic where it's changed up or down unexpectedly, and I mean just a few times in 6k miles and 18 months of ownership.

Has your S DCT been like this from new?

Maybe there's nowt wrong and the bike is not suited to you?

No like I say it was fine at least for the first 700 - 800 miles, The fuelling issue does seem to be a recent problem when warm, always been a bit lumpy at cold, My old Gilera Nexus was sweet as a nut after 10,000 miles, come on this is digital fuel injection, if my Ford Focus ran like this I would be back at Ford

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Guest Firebladeaid

The only way to find out if yours is running ok is to test ride another bike--then you will know for sure if the dealer needs to set yours up correctly --or it's you that needs to try riding in different modes--I have never tried the DCT even though --with all the aches and pains in hands it would be benificial--I still like the power to override the trottle with my clutch lever  :thumbsup:

 

Don't lose heart you will one way or tudder you will sort it and start enjoying the bike to it's full potential. :D

I do like the bike, when it does as I expect I love it, and sometimes it does  but its still a temperamental thing that you can not rely on to perform reliably every time, to be cranked over round a traffic island on a steady throttle and the it changes dow is not good, I did expect better from Honda and a second generation incarnation.

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Guest Firebladeaid

Have to say, in town I use sport, on twisties I use sport and for just cruising I use drive. Also use drive when my Yorkshireness wants more miles per litre. I also tend to override the box going down rather than up - the box seems to have learned my preferences over time. Auto gear changes, when they happen, are so smooth I often do not notice them. The advantage with manual is that changes are instant as well as smooth, with no hesitation at all and you can hang on to a gear until you want to change, not when the bike wants to.  It is like a very superior quickshifter.

Do you not find its loud and clunky in first three changes sometimes ??

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baben

No, generally uncannily smooth!


Sounds to me they had been on the saki when they built yours.

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fred_jb

Do you not find its loud and clunky in first three changes sometimes ??

In S mode the upward shifts are virtually imperceptible, admittedly a little more noticeable in D mode, when it changes up at much lower revs.   For downshifts I find these can sometimes be a little lurchy if I let it change down at its preferred (low) speed.   Instead I do most of the down changes myself now that I have fitted the foot shift and tend to down change at slightly higher speeds than the DCT would, and this seems to make the down changes much smoother.

 

Fred

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Tonyj

Mine not like this either . 750 dct and I would say wether it's shit or not ,14k since October

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Guest Firebladeaid

Well left the bike with Vertu Honda in Nottingham,  they found nothing showing up on data when they plugged it in.

 

They did a reset which sets bite points of the clutches and said see how I go.

Well I rode it away and did 3 miles back home and no probs, but bear in mind its not a constant problem.

Went work that afternoon and within 1 mile it did its lurching again, I actually noticed a 2 segment drop on tacho so at least 400 rpm which when in 1st/second gear can be a bit disconcerting when approaching a stop situation !!!

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fred_jb

Well left the bike with Vertu Honda in Nottingham,  they found nothing showing up on data when they plugged it in.

 

They did a reset which sets bite points of the clutches and said see how I go.

Well I rode it away and did 3 miles back home and no probs, but bear in mind its not a constant problem.

Went work that afternoon and within 1 mile it did its lurching again, I actually noticed a 2 segment drop on tacho so at least 400 rpm which when in 1st/second gear can be a bit disconcerting when approaching a stop situation !!!

 

Is this lurching an engine response thing while in a gear but slowing down, or is it associated with a gear change - either up or down?  

 

In D mode the bike changes up at relatively low revs, which can be a bit lurchy anyway - and of course when it changes up then the revs are going to drop even further to match the higher gear to the road speed.  Because of the frequent up shifts in D mode you are also more likely to get the situation where it starts to shift up just as you back off the throttle to slow down, which sometimes seems to cause some momentary confusion to the system, and even more of a lurch.   This sort of thing is why I rarely use D mode.   Do you get the same issue in S mode?

 

It would be a bit stranger if this is happening on down shifts.  Down shifts would normally result in the engine revs going up, regardless of whether it does it smoothly or jerkily. If your revs are dropping on down changes, then I think it is a different problem than clutch biting points, etc.

 

With a down shift the bike cannot blip the throttle to bring the revs up to match the lower gear.  My guess is that it slightly slips the clutch as the lower gear goes in to smooth out the process of the engine revs rising to match the lower gear to the road speed, and how smoothly this happens is probably something which can be tweaked with a reset, but nevertheless the revs should always be going up on a down shift, not down

 

Fred

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embee

Have you tried the ECU reset procedure? This is not the same as the clutch initiation procedure which sounds like what the Honda folk have done.

 

It's very simple, all you need to be able to do on the technical front is disconnect the battery for a while then reconnect it.

 

This is the link to the procedure. It's free, and in total takes all of 30mins or so. Follow the procedure EXACTLY, especially regarding not ttouching the throttle and the switching on and off details. Try it, you've nothing to lose.

http://www.nc700.co.uk/index.php?/topic/4779-resetting-the-ecu-ecm/?hl=reset

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Guest Firebladeaid

Is this lurching an engine response thing while in a gear but slowing down, or is it associated with a gear change - either up or down?  

 

In D mode the bike changes up at relatively low revs, which can be a bit lurchy anyway - and of course when it changes up then the revs are going to drop even further to match the higher gear to the road speed.  Because of the frequent up shifts in D mode you are also more likely to get the situation where it starts to shift up just as you back off the throttle to slow down, which sometimes seems to cause some momentary confusion to the system, and even more of a lurch.   This sort of thing is why I rarely use D mode.   Do you get the same issue in S mode?

 

It would be a bit stranger if this is happening on down shifts.  Down shifts would normally result in the engine revs going up, regardless of whether it does it smoothly or jerkily. If your revs are dropping on down changes, then I think it is a different problem than clutch biting points, etc.

 

With a down shift the bike cannot blip the throttle to bring the revs up to match the lower gear.  My guess is that it slightly slips the clutch as the lower gear goes in to smooth out the process of the engine revs rising to match the lower gear to the road speed, and how smoothly this happens is probably something which can be tweaked with a reset, but nevertheless the revs should always be going up on a down shift, not down

 

Fred

Hi Fred,   no my problem is on a constant throttle, running along at say 20 mph in traffic at a steady rpm,   its not about gear changes, its a sudden dip and recovery of rpm, like I say I saw a 400 rpm segment drop and recover, drop and recover,  its enough to nearly make it kangaroo as we say,   I always ride in S mode, its even done it in manual mode,  at my works its a 20mph speed limit, the site is very big so I am running at 20mph for 3 mins approx. and some days its embarrassing !!

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Guest goldfish

This sounds like a different issue to DCT gear changes then. My DCT does not do what you describe - at a constant throttle or RPM its as steady as a rock. No dips in engine speed, no lurching, no gear changes. Maybe you have a fuel or sensor issue but it would be tough to offer more without more detailed info.

 

Does this happen in every gear or just one? What speed or rpm (or any constant speed or rpm)? Could be as simple as crud in the fuel. Or not.

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fred_jb

Hi Fred,   no my problem is on a constant throttle, running along at say 20 mph in traffic at a steady rpm,   its not about gear changes, its a sudden dip and recovery of rpm, like I say I saw a 400 rpm segment drop and recover, drop and recover,  its enough to nearly make it kangaroo as we say,   I always ride in S mode, its even done it in manual mode,  at my works its a 20mph speed limit, the site is very big so I am running at 20mph for 3 mins approx. and some days its embarrassing !!

If this is happening all the time I would think a fuel issue, or maybe even something like a blocked breather pipe on the fuel tank.   However, if it's random I would suspect a failing sensor. I believe that the O2 sensor only influences the fuelling on a steady throttle, so this might be the prime suspect.

 

Fred

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