brake overhaul

[Steve Case 955]

I generally pop the calipers off before and after winter to clean out the salt and crap and give the pistons a clean with brake and clutch cleaner and a toothbrush.

I am starting to see corrosion breaking thru the piston coating and they still work but i feel in the next couple of years they will seize and require rebuilding or replacing.

So finally the questions are has anyone had any luck in reducing the corrosion buildup and if the calipers need removed where can the lines be clamped or blocked off to prevent the fluid exiting as I do not want to bleed the abs controller.

[fj_stuart 4,753]

Smear the piston in red grease. This is designed for hydraulic applications and is rubber safe. Get a hose clamping tool from the auction site.

 

 

[Johnnie Mototrans 2,766]

Check Wemoto for their rebuild kit.

It worked for me.

[Andy m 23,532]

Red grease is good.

 

I see damage done by the clamping tools, although they are better than mole grips.

 

I'd simply raise the caliper as high as it will go, preferably above the move the modulator, remove, then shove a rubber bung or fluid filled syringe in the banjo bolt. There aren't many systems that won't bleed with vacuum tools or a big medical syringe. Apply the brake to fill the hose with fluid before reconnecting. Wear gloves obviously.

 

Andy

[davebike 943]

If you going to work on teh callipers an M10 nut and bolt and two sealing washee makes a good long term seal  I use exactly thay hpose clamp for short term sealing

I use sillicone greas rather the red around brakes these days as I find it slightly better

 

[Steve Case 955]

Cheers one and all.

I have used red grease in the past tho it does attract dust, quite happy to keep using it but since this is specifically the pistons would anything else prevent the corrosion?

I am paranoid about losing fluid from the abs as they are a complete mare to fill and rebleed... ask me how i know.

I had looked at pipe clamps but the pipes are all reinforced so would a clamp damage these?

Dave as ever your solutions are simple and workable, do you use fiber washers or similar?

Anyway thanks as ever, i appreciate any suggestions.

[Slowboy 20,457]

1 hour ago, Steve Case said:

Cheers one and all.

I have used red grease in the past tho it does attract dust, quite happy to keep using it but since this is specifically the pistons would anything else prevent the corrosion?

 

It doesn’t affect the rubber seals on your braking system, ie they won’t swell or degrade as they might if in contact with LM type grease.

 

1 hour ago, Steve Case said:

I am paranoid about losing fluid from the abs as they are a complete mare to fill and rebleed... ask me how i know.

I had looked at pipe clamps but the pipes are all reinforced so would a clamp damage these?

 

I don’t use pipe clamps because there is no better vowel loosener than finding out they do affect your brake pipes when you apply a mighty pull or stamp on them when it matters. I’d rather just re bleed the system, noting your other comment, I use a vacuum bleeder which seems to be pretty ok, mostly.

[Steve Case 955]

Oh i have no issues with bleeding the system thru which i do every 2 or 3 years, this is specifically to do with loss of fluid from removing the calipers.

I lost the fluid from my car abs controller once and it required pressure bleeding and operating the controller with a diag unit and even then it was never 100% again, unlike the old bosch units modern controllers dont have bleed valves and every effort should be made to prevent loss of fluid.

Just saying as its better to be cautious than the other thing happening.

[davebike 943]

Don't panic about getting air in NC brakes I changed several callipers and changed my own rear master cylinder  never had an issue or had to use anything but the simple bleed system

I am yet to find a Honda system that is hard to refill or bleed even teh four channel combined linked ST1300 systems bleed easly 

The same cannot be said for some European bikes!

 

[Steve Case 955]

Thanks Dave, as long as I'm prepared I am happy, and I understand i will lose some fluid but I was worried that I may not get the caliper overhauled in a day and if the fluid is dripping it may evacuate below the abs controller.

Actually if i bolt the banjo as you said and pull the hose up as Andy suggested it cannot exit the abs and i could leave it standing.

It sounds like a plan.

[MPG100 393]

I guess running the pads to the limit means the pistons move long way and get exposed to salt etc. For those not savvy enough to strip brakes is simple preventative maintenance poss? Eg: Remove complete caliper assy, Insert something bit thinner than the brake disc, Operate the brake, Clean round the newly exposed pistons and smear on fresh red grease, Pry back the pads / pistons just enough to refit the caliper over disc ~ job done. But is this suggestion doable or daft as a way of stopping piston corrosion without getting involved in clamping off and poss damaging pipes or needing to bleed brakes???? 

[Skidt 1,305]

17 minutes ago, MPG100 said:

But is this suggestion doable or daft as a way of stopping piston corrosion without getting involved in clamping off and poss damaging pipes or needing to bleed brakes???? 

It’s what I do each year and seems to work fine for me. Clearly, I do change the brake fluid every now and again as well

[Andy m 23,532]

You should be doing exactly this at each tyre change, if not once a year.

 

However, if the previous owner or dealers monkey has not kept up to things and the corrosion gets ahead it's a piston kit job. Eventually you will still need the kit just through wear.

 

Caliper pistons have certainly suffered from the ban on real chrome. You have something that is in contact with brake fluid, very salty water and a heat cycle. You'd struggle to come up with a better way to create weird oxides.

 

Andy

[jeremyr62 2,557]

When I had a 2004 FJR it came will silver spot calipers. There were blue, silver and gold spot calipers on various bikes at the time. Only the R1 had gold spots. (This was before Brembo were a mass market offering). The pistons in the blue and silver spots were the standard steel chromed affairs, but the Gold had aluminium alloy pistons. It wasn't a sophisticated alloy as they were very corrosion resistant. They were much thicker than the steel pistons being lower strength and stiffness so Yamaha weren't doing it to save weight. Of course I had a set. They were easy to sell on too.

[Steve Case 955]

The coating on the honda pistons is not bad but will not last forever, the suzuki caliper had chrome pistons which lasted 3 winters before giving up the ghost.

The bmw had some ceramic type pistons that never oxidised.

Anyone tried the stainless steel pistons and how do thet last?

[Slowboy 20,457]

17 hours ago, Steve Case said:

 

Anyone tried the stainless steel pistons and how do thet last?

Yes, always cleaned up well at the annual post winter check and never had any further issues with them over 3 to 4 years. In those days I was commuting every day.

Edited January 15 by Slowboy

[Phantom53 13]

On 13/01/2024 at 17:09, davebike said:

Don't panic about getting air in NC brakes I changed several callipers and changed my own rear master cylinder  never had an issue or had to use anything but the simple bleed system

I am yet to find a Honda system that is hard to refill or bleed even teh four channel combined linked ST1300 systems bleed easly 

The same cannot be said for some European bikes!

 

Hi Dave

I agree with you about the Honda bleed system. I had a 2010 ST1300 and i bled the brakes 3 times over the years , and there were i think 7 or 8 steps in the process, 

and it had to be done in sequence and if you missed one , start over again. The NC is a pretty simple bike to work on concerning maintenance issues.

 

Phantom