Bike dealers. I despair!

[Guest RobF]

I've been building and restoring bikes since I was 17. Apart from buying a new harley in 1989 and a couple of virtually new bmw gs bikes I've always bought older bikes, stripped them and rebuilt them to suit my needs so I'm more than confident around bikes and servicing them.

Buying the nc was a spur of the moment thing. I'm pretty busy at the minute and wanted a mule to zip about and have some fun on and the nc fitted the bill.

The problem comes now that it needs a service. I thought I'd get a least a couple of service stamps in to keep the warranty all tickets boo but to be honest the dealers are taking the p!ss with the prices they're charging and on top of that I haven't spoken to one them that inspires me with any confidence and hasn't given me a load of bullshit about what's involved. It's just a ****** oil change!!! I've given up on honda dealers so thought I'd ask the local yamaha dealer, told him I wanted a genuine honda filter for the warranty and got a load of bullshit about all the filters are made by the same factory "so that would be a pattern filter then?"....

I run a 3 litre jaguar that's cheaper to have serviced at the main dealer who does a really good job on it and talks to me like I'm a human. I'm expected to pay more for some meathead to perform a simple task on a twin cylinder simple bike and wants to charge a packet to do it on top of that they talk to you like you haven't a clue what's involved...

And breath!!!.....

Just needed to get that off my chest.

[Guest bonekicker]

 Well Rob that's exactly what most of us think of the Dealers service---it is just for the warranty--and is over priced for basically a oil and filter change--We paid £65 for our last Toyota car for oil and filter and levels, but that was for warranty--They had told us it was £95 and it was washed and vacuum--no thanks the wife doe's it cheaper.  Servicing as got to be one of the best money making racket's ever invented---I can do my own bike and car-- and I would change oil and filter every  4000 miles-- and feel more confident and have more money left in my pocket.

[Guest Southerner]

I run a 3 litre jaguar that's cheaper to have serviced at the main dealer who does a really good job on it and talks to me like I'm a human. I'm expected to pay more for some meathead to perform a simple task on a twin cylinder simple bike and wants to charge a packet to do it on top of that they talk to you like you haven't a clue what's involved...

 

Yep, 5 Series BMW here which, over a typical 3 year period, is cheaper to service than the NCX. Both do around the same mileage per year, 3500. Same goes for our Zafira, service cost wise, but that does around 9000 miles per year.

 

First 600 mile service should be about £100 (yes just an oil change), first annual around £130 - £150. Thereafter, do it yourself - I will be.

 

If you've always DIYd, then yes the service costs are a shock.

[bazza 3,629]

In the "old days" yes you could service things yourself - ok a bit fiddly checking valve clearances etc with feeler gauges and so on but with the spec it was do-able.Now we have PCB electronic controlled everything and although the basic engine is simple not sure about other bits i.e my DCT gearbox.

But you are both right -now days they don't employ mechanics, just "fitters" who can unbolt and then screw on a new part.

So given that legally you don't need a Honda dealer to stamp the book to ensure a guarantee, you can use a suitable workshop IF you can find one. If you are a frequent "changer of your bike" I reckon it's probably better to use that main dealer so you get the best price when you sell (privately)

I have just acquired a Suz 1250 -swopped my KTM -on the basis that its easier to shift it than an 11 year old 47k adventure bike- and am having HUGE problems getting copies of service sheets from the main dealer who did them  -they talk "data protection" but really they are covering up the fact it was clocked.

so if you buy and sell privately I cant see a problem as long as you show the parts receipts ,dated, if you do the work yourself -and are selling privately. i know I would be happy with a seller who did his own mechanicals - you soon learn if someone knows his stuff!

[stordz 901]

In the "old days" yes you could service things yourself - ok a bit fiddly checking valve clearances etc with feeler gauges and so on but with the spec it was do-able.Now we have PCB electronic controlled everything and although the basic engine is simple not sure about other bits i.e my DCT gearbox.

But you are both right -now days they don't employ mechanics, just "fitters" who can unbolt and then screw on a new part.

So given that legally you don't need a Honda dealer to stamp the book to ensure a guarantee, you can use a suitable workshop IF you can find one. If you are a frequent "changer of your bike" I reckon it's probably better to use that main dealer so you get the best price when you sell (privately)

 

 

 

+1

Edited February 25, 2015 by stordz

[Trev 18,703]

Bought my NC700X second hand (4 months old) and had first service at local Honda garage to be 100% sure on warrantly. This was the first service I've ever had worekd on at a main dealer in 30+ years of riding and although experience was okay the cost did seem very high for what was done. I'm not knocking my local Honda dealer as price was about the same as the others I called and they did the job ok but wanted to charge me if I wanted a loan bike, needed the bike all morning, wifi was rubbish so a pain to work while I waited, did get free coffee from the machine though.

 

Have been fortunate enough to have company cars for the last dozen years or so and certainly my Volvo dealer knocks spots off for service and the cost (on a 24k mile a year, £50k+ car) is lower than the NC, even if I include tyres. On top of that I get free loan car or a time slot for services and an environment that allows me to wait and work. I appreciate that Volvo get more buck from for the car but servicing a bike (certainly first service on a low powered twin) should be a piece of wee wee and easily sub £100.

 

For my next service I went to my local guy and got him to 'do the lot' as I was out of kilter with miles/age of bike (over 11k miles in under 12 months). In hindsight this was overkill and at £300+ not cheap (included brake fluids, fork oil + tappet check + spark plugs £21 each[!!] and a week on back order from Honda) but I wanted to know what was involved and whether the valve clearances had moved and would likely need checking at the prescribed service intervals as I plan to do all my own servicing in the future. BTW he hasn't even got a chair to sit on or a coffee machine but we seem to accept that from small independents in return for great service and first hand explanation of what's been done and all old parts removed presented for inspection.

[Rocker66 34,465]

HERE WE GO AGAIN!!!. When will people appreciate that not all dealers are the same. Yes some may be rip off merchants but not all and in fact some are very good. My local dealer had had many good comments from members of this forum. I had a very good experience with Lloyds in Carlisle (sorry to those who may have read this before). I was on my way up to Scotland on tour when my Crossrunner was knocked over damaging a lever.. I went to Lloyds who had never seen me before and explained the situation. They didn't have a lever in stock but took one off a brand new Crossrunner in the showroom and fitted it for me. I was given a free cup of coffee whilst they were doing so. The charge for this service? Just the cost of the lever. I offered the young guy who had fitted it "a drink" which he declined. These are hardly the actions of a rip off merchant

Please lets not have the generalisations and criticise those dealers that give bad service and/or overcharge but on the other hand give credit where credit is due 

[Guest bonekicker]

But you are saying here we go again when you have not encountered this very expensive problem--believe me knowing very little about you --I would still bet £1000 that you would go absolutely mad amongst other things-- please do not stick up for overpriced and poor workmanship-- we would not complain but the bike is advertised as economical, are these are basic work we can do our selves-- it's a different story if something with engine goes wrong we have not got the right tools or knowledge to handle it ---but putting a empty container under sump plug --undoing a bolt letting oil drain out --refit bolt and tighten--unscrewing a oil filter and re screwing a new filter-- filling engine oil back up--start engine for a couple of minutes--recheck level-- Is not brain surgery and would take --what 15 mins from start to finish--using genuine parts-- for the princely price of around £40 instead of £159-- now come on ???

[Guest Mokel]

HERE WE GO AGAIN!!!. 

Please lets not have the generalisations and criticise those dealers that give bad service and/or overcharge but on the other hand give credit where credit is due 

 

Indeed we do...

 

Are you saying we should only dish out praise? Good experiences warrant that, bad ones the opposite.

Or we must suffer in silence and not tell anybody..?

 

If you happened upon genuinely dreadful service/treatment, you'd just swallow it, right? 

[embee 7,288]

We all know the score on Dealerships, they have to make a living and operating a bricks and mortar place with employees is expensive these days, so overheads have to be covered. It isn't usually the prices so much as the poor service often encountered at bike dealerships (Rockers comments accepted and agreed with). Bike dealerships are a generation behind car dealerships generally speaking, a whole different league. I know from 20yrs ago when I was still working for a car manufacturer that the issue of dealer service was right up at the top of the list, people would accept things going wrong with their cars (up to a point) but what would guarantee the loss of a future customer was bad dealer service. The company got rid of a whole raft of poorly performing dealers.

 

Some bike dealers seem to get it, but others clearly don't.

 

As another example, a friend has a Toyota Aygo which has a 3yr warranty extended to 5yrs if you have the last services done by Toyota. We enquired at the local dealership, £99 fixed price INCLUDING collect and return the car, and wash and valet thrown in. That was good service, and a cheap way to extend the warranty seeing as it needed a service anyway.

[Rocker66 34,465]

Indeed we do...

 

Are you saying we should only dish out praise? Good experiences warrant that, bad ones the opposite.

Or we must suffer in silence and not tell anybody..?

 

If you happened upon genuinely dreadful service/treatment, you'd just swallow it, right? 

PLEASE!!!! read what I posted and I quote " Please lets not have the generalisations and criticise those dealers that give bad service and/or overcharge but on the other hand give credit where credit is due "  this clearly states that we SHOULD cticise bad dealers but also give post to those that look after customers. 

[Dave H 2,022]

I'm assuming that the service does not have to be performed at a Honda dealership but that any competent dealer could stamp the book and the warranty would be intact.

[Rocker66 34,465]

But you are saying here we go again when you have not encountered this very expensive problem--believe me knowing very little about you --I would still bet £1000 that you would go absolutely mad amongst other things-- please do not stick up for overpriced and poor workmanship-- we would not complain but the bike is advertised as economical, are these are basic work we can do our selves-- it's a different story if something with engine goes wrong we have not got the right tools or knowledge to handle it ---but putting a empty container under sump plug --undoing a bolt letting oil drain out --refit bolt and tighten--unscrewing a oil filter and re screwing a new filter-- filling engine oil back up--start engine for a couple of minutes--recheck level-- Is not brain surgery and would take --what 15 mins from start to finish--using genuine parts-- for the princely price of around £40 instead of £159-- now come on ???

 

But you are saying here we go again when you have not encountered this very expensive problem--believe me knowing very little about you --I would still bet £1000 that you would go absolutely mad amongst other things-- please do not stick up for overpriced and poor workmanship-- we would not complain but the bike is advertised as economical, are these are basic work we can do our selves-- it's a different story if something with engine goes wrong we have not got the right tools or knowledge to handle it ---but putting a empty container under sump plug --undoing a bolt letting oil drain out --refit bolt and tighten--unscrewing a oil filter and re screwing a new filter-- filling engine oil back up--start engine for a couple of minutes--recheck level-- Is not brain surgery and would take --what 15 mins from start to finish--using genuine parts-- for the princely price of around £40 instead of £159-- now come on ???

PLEASE!!!! read what I posted  I clearly state that whilst I agree that there are bad dealers there are also good ones. It's the tarring of all dealers with the same brush that I object to.. If your local dealer is not good enough for you then travel a bit further to a good one That's what I do

[Guest bonekicker]

We are reading very clearly what you are saying but you are not reading what members are complaining about---

 

And Yes we all agree that if good service is done we will praise them--that is not the comments at this time.

 

Please don't just dive in guns blazing, telling us off--we are entitled to have a say--are we not? 

[Rocker66 34,465]

We are reading very clearly what you are saying but you are not reading what members are complaining about---

 

And Yes we all agree that if good service is done we will praise them--that is not the comments at this time.

 

Please don't just dive in guns blazing, telling us off--we are entitled to have a say--are we not? 

 Yes and again I said criticise the bad.The point is that the heading says Dealers which suggests that all dealers are the same. If it something along the lines of my local dealer or the dealers I contacted which would limit to certain dealers that would be different. I don't see why decent dealers like those I mentioned and I'm sure members could name others should be judged by the failing of others..

On a visit to Goodison Park I was treated to some very unfriendly behaviour by the locals but that doesn't mean that it would be correct for me to say that all Northerners are unfriendly would it.

Is it so difficult to say some dealers or even dealer X or dealer Y give bad service rather than all dealers. That's all I'm asking

Edited February 25, 2015 by Rocker66

[Guest bonekicker]

You know me better than most members-- even though we have never meet-- I don't think for one second that if we did meet I would give you any stick for coming from a different part of this Great Country--and I do welcome all peoples views about any subject-- but you are taking this point completely out of context -- if we try and smother members putting their own views and experiences on any post -- that would be a real shame-- and wrong.

[Rocker66 34,465]

You know me better than most members-- even though we have never meet-- I don't think for one second that if we did meet I would give you any stick for coming from a different part of this Great Country--and I do welcome all peoples views about any subject-- but you are taking this point completely out of context -- if we try and smother members putting their own views and experiences on any post -- that would be a real shame-- and wrong.

Maybe I'm not posting in clear English I am not saying that people should not complain about bad service overcharging or problems with dealers In fact I would encourage it . I am just saying direct the complaint and comments at the dealer(s) concerned and NOT dealers in general. 

Somebody recently posted that they would not use Laguna because they are too big. I fully agree with this comment. In fac this firm have 4 shops a multi franchise which is about 5 min walk from my house a Triumph shop less than 5 min ride away a Honda shop and a Harley shop both around 20 miles away from me. Due their impersonal service I choose to ride even further to a dealer where I get much better service as have others on here.

The problem with geralisations is that it gives good people a bad reputation. I mean would it be fair to call all Chelsea supporters racist just because a few that are made the national headlines this week or say that all police officers are liars just because a few have proved to be? Of course it wouldn't be so why say that ALL dealers are bad when it's not so

[Guest bonekicker]

Why Have I travelled to Manchester to get a bike-- because I am not happy with my local Dealers-- I can spend my money were I want too just like every one else is entitled to-- and is entitled to speak and tell others about their experience good or bad.

 

I have stood by what I say and what I mean.

 

There is no confusion about anything that we are complaining about-- these are our own personal views--no one is saying any more than that-- nothing more.

 

We do not expect every one to agree at all -- but please don't say "not again"  we talk about all issues again and again or their would be very little too say, and as new member's come along they want to know other members views-- on again subjects-- we are all willing to help one another --no problem.

[Rocker66 34,465]

I give up .. I have been saying all along that people are entitled to talk about their experiences bad or good. What I'm saying is that if they have a bad experience with dealer A then they shouldn't suggest that every dealer from B to Z will also be bad. The fact that your travelling to buy you're new bike shows that you must feel that the one your buying from is better than your local one else why travel. ergo you must feel that they are not all the same. That's all i'm asking people to say

As to posting an opinion if you do you have to expect those with different ones to post theirs which is what I'm doing.

So far it seems that I'm not allowed to say that not all dealers are bad or that I I personally don't like DCT. I have at times been not only criticised for both these views but told that I'm not allowed to post them. NB I have always asked people not to classify all dealers the same as opposed to telling them

Hopefully for the last time I will say PLEASE!!! don't classify all dealers as being the same as they vary from very bad to very good with most being at different stages between the two

[RussB644 379]

I for one value the collective advice of everyone on this forum, seeking out value for money where I can. Looking through your posts gives me a good idea about what sort of cost I should be looking at for as 'good value' and at the opposite end of the spectrum, what dealers are to be avoided. I'd like the good and the bad please, and in turn will publish any feedback I can contribute in the future. 

[MikeBike 5,006]

As I read it, Rocker 66 is just saying more or less:

- Don't generalise, ( like the thread title implying dealers in general),

and we should rather

- Name and shame the bad

- Name and praise the good

 

At first I also 'speed read' his post and misread it as not wanting criticism of dealers, so can understand the reactions, but if you carefully read it you'll see he didn't want any supression of views, he was just against generalisations, and tarring all with the same brush..

Edited February 25, 2015 by MikeBike

[Rocker66 34,465]

I for one value the collective advice of everyone on this forum, seeking out value for money where I can. Looking through your posts gives me a good idea about what sort of cost I should be looking at for as 'good value' and at the opposite end of the spectrum, what dealers are to be avoided. I'd like the good and the bad please, and in turn will publish any feedback I can contribute in the future. 

Exactly my view although sometimes the cheapest is not always the best. I look for good service at reasonable prices. this is the reason I suggest that each dealer should be judged on their own merits and not all lumped together

[Guest nigel w]

I'm afraid it's like most things in life the bad one's tarnish it for all.

[Rocker66 34,465]

I'm afraid it's like most things in life the bad one's tarnish it for all.

Sadly true but that doesn't make it right

[nelmo 563]

When I saw the title of this thread , I immediately put money on Rocker going ..er...off his rocker

The only certainties are:

ALL dealers are more expensive than doing it yourself.

Having a full service history WILL get you more money when/if you come to sell.